WW: LXXXV - The Lost Philosophers of Maiar

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Aganzir

While it's good to consider everything, I think you're either being slightly paranoid or trying to distract us. The chances she was lying are extremely slim - you just don't do that if you have to drop out of the game. Not that I like the lack of information much, either.

I don't want Kit lynched toDay. I can't see it coming out well for this confused a village. Distraction? The whole thing is, actually. Now let's talk about you emerging from the cloak of cobblerishness in which you enveloped yourself yesterDay. We can be sure, at least, that if the wolves got your name last Night, they knew why. That aside, are you saying you did it for reactions? Why, then, is Wilwa suspicious for seeing your plan for what it was (and why, for that matter, am I not? I had the same reaction as Wilwa).
You're giving a stabbing-in-all-directions-hoping-something-hits-home impression which could still be called cobblerish toDay. On one hand, I approve of that strategy; testing out reactions, looking for wolfish defences. Still, there are different ways to do it, I think. I feel as though you're waiting more for consensus than for evil to show itself, which makes me uneasy.
Pitch is suspicious, but a bit too widely suspected. Have his packmates decided to sacrifice him this early? I should be writing a thesis proposal, but I think I'll have to put together an analysis of Pitch first...

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Rikae

I don't want Kit lynched toDay. I can't see it coming out well for this confused a village. Distraction? The whole thing is, actually.

I don't want her lynched today either, but it's a bit of a stretch to question if she actually is the hunter.

That aside, are you saying you did it for reactions? Why, then, is Wilwa suspicious for seeing your plan for what it was (and why, for that matter, am I not? I had the same reaction as Wilwa).

Yes and no. Fishing for reactions wasn't in my plans until I realised how easy it was in this particular situation.
The thing with wilwa is, she spoke like twice about how I put sally's cobbler point into the spotlight. If I'm innocent and someone who's behaved cobblerish goes and underlines a statement that basically says "the cobbler might send her own name tonight," I'd think "Ah-ha! You got caught! Lynch!" while wilwa hasn't really suspected me because of it. Not that I mind (because I actually am innocent ), but it looks a bit too careful to my liking.

I feel as though you're waiting more for consensus than for evil to show itself, which makes me uneasy.

What do you mean?

Originally Posted by skip spence

Actually I've a statement to make:

I am the real hunter.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Originally Posted by Legate

That's not to say that Zil's post didn't make me paranoid about him instantly, quite the opposite. Someone who starts the Day with first post saying "both the kills have something to do with me" is either insane or weird. Of course, it can be just stating the obvious of an Ordo who is just stating facts, and in fact, that's what innocents often do, as they have no calculativeness behind their statements. They often end up lynched for that as well. Nonetheless, paranoid it makes me, but I am not going to put any weight to it, just because of what I have said just now.

I don't like this. Legate goes out of his way to say how suspicious Inzil's first post makes him, and finishes with "I suspect him but I don't really".

Originally Posted by Rikae

Did she? I didn't even see that, but if she did, it's not as if it was her idea. Mac-cobbler did that in a game I think she was in as well as several others here. Hmm.

I did that myself, in the game of epic-cobbler-fail. So it's not as if it's unusual. I'm not sure how Wilwa's defense of her vote strikes me - the tone seems innocent enough, but I can't help but wonder if Wilwa is deflecting attention from the Sally-wagon for some reason.

Legate's #174... something strikes me as 'off' there. I'm not sure what, exactly, but it's the part about "well this is why I suspected Lottie yesterday, but I don't suspect her anymore" when he doesn't go on to explain exactly why, just referencing 'her later posts'.

I've never played a game with Cailin by herself, I don't think, but as of #178 I adore her!

Originally Posted by Rikae

So, Wilwa not mentioning the fact that Sally mentioned the possible cobbler-hinting, lest the cobbler notice.
Looks very shiny toDay, but I wonder why she wouldn't do her best to get Sally lynched if she thought it was such a good case against her, in favor of trying to hide something already in the open. Hers was the first vote for Sally, after all.

Rikae raises a good point here, I think.

Re: Pitch's #183 - Why would a Nessa Wolfrunya be hinting at a Seer-Rikae in the first place? I don't understand it.

Originally Posted by Inzil

Mac worries me because he's been unnaturally passive, for him.

I don't think Mac's been passive at all, actually - in my opinion he's been one of the louder voices.

Re: Kitanna's #195 - oy gevalt.

Originally Posted by Mac

Sally was not a very likely lynch until very late, so if a wolf was on the line, I'm sure a better person to vote for could have been found.

I'm not sure I agree with you. That Sallywagon sprang up awfully late in the day, to be purely-innocent driven.

Originally Posted by Mac

Maybe I'm paranoid, but this sounds like an attempt to cover up the fact that a fellow wolf was in the running yesterDay, too.

I disagree. Eomer is rather emphatic and callous normally - I think this is probably just a playstyle reference.

Originally Posted by Boro

Pitch has a nickname that seems stuck with him forever, Mr. Agreeable, and this usually gets him suspected early and often. With the unexplained uneasy feelings and Pitch being agreeable, I saw the same thing happening yesterday. Maybe he is a wolf, but I'm not his companion.

Hum. After Mac's post calling him out for defending PItch yesterday, all this looks like to me is damage-control distancing.

Originally Posted by Legate

And, there is one thing I really don't like: I am starting to suspect Inzil. A bit, but anyway. Which is horrible, thinking that in such a case it would be, what, the fifth time in a row he was a Wolf? But maybe I haven't seen him "normal" for such a long time that... well, never mind. I am not going to continue on that just now, I am merely wary about him.

So, wait, let me get this straight. First you're "paranoid" about Inzil, but then you won't "put any weight to it", but now you're "starting to suspect" him, but wait, no, you're just "merely wary"? Just for clarification.

Originally Posted by Skip

I've seen this sentiment elsewhere and I don't like it. Inzil is shrewd and could of course alter his playing style to suit a particular game.

Cailin made this point softly earlier, too. I just want to go on record that I agree with the general statement.

Originally Posted by Lommy

Exactly, that made me raise my eyebrows too. Besides, Zil said that mere three minutes after Nog's post. So either he has excellent memory and quick brains, he's a super fast checker (and thinker) or he actually knew the kill before the DL. Very fishy, I think.

Hum. This is... a good point, actually. Could it be this simple?

Originally Posted by Cailin

She has definitely done little to make her look innocent.

I'm not sure about this statement (regarding Nessa). Having to 'make oneself look innocent' implies that one is not in fact innocent - otherwise why make yourself look like something that you already are? Does this mean you suspect Nessa, Cailin?

Regarding Skip and his hunter claim - I don't buy it. I think he was just looking for an epic 1000th post.

Regarding Kitanna - I'm going to voice an idea no one seems to have come up with yet - given that there are currently five baddies and two kills a night, it doesn't really seem fair to the village to handicap them due to inactivity. I personally think the fair thing to do would be to redistribute Kitanna's role. *shrug*

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I don't like this. Legate goes out of his way to say how suspicious Inzil's first post makes him, and finishes with "I suspect him but I don't really".

(...)

So, wait, let me get this straight. First you're "paranoid" about Inzil, but then you won't "put any weight to it", but now you're "starting to suspect" him, but wait, no, you're just "merely wary"? Just for clarification.

Basically, you are quite right with the second part: that is a good summarisation. I didn't say that I was suspicious, as you put it in the first part, I was "paranoid", as you correctly state in the latter. Not putting any weight to it, and recently, growing more wary of him. Nothing complicated, really. It is not both parts of the same process, they have been two unrelated instances, his first post to which I was paranoid, and then later I realised I'm starting becoming suspicious of him. Simple as that.

And sorry for triple-posting, but blame the person up there.

[Aganzir]

Hey people, skip is referring to a fake hunter reveal he once did as an ordo, so no need to get worried. At least that's what I think.

[skip spence]

haha, relax people, just a joke, I'm not the hunter.

For those who didn't play in Lommy's game a few months back, I falsely and foolishly claimed to be the hunter in that game.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by skip spence

haha, relax people, just a joke!

For those who didn't play in Lommy's game a few months back, I falsely and foolishly claimed to be the hunter in that game.

Oh, I well remember that! Don't be difficult, though. As I recall, that didn't turn out so well for the good side.

[skip spence]

As usual I'm getting really confused (and a headache from trying to concentrate)

some random thoughts:

I wouldn't have voted Sally if I didn't think she was suspicious AND that there was a chance that she would get lynched. That said, I was a little surprised to see all the late votes for her which might seem opportunistic (trying to save a fellow?) but for me to accuse the late-comers for it (Agan, Lottie, Lommy) would be throwing rocks in a glass-house. I also agree with Agan that the reasons stated to vote for Sally weren't as bad as they are made out to be in some quarters, especially given the Cobbler-thing, although I myself didn't think of that at the time.

Originally Posted by Shasta

Re: Pitch's #183 - Why would a Nessa Wolfrunya be hinting at a Seer-Rikae in the first place? I don't understand it.

Good point. A cobbler-Nessa might, though... Speaking of Nessa, I had a brief look at her posts and the feeling I got was... well, that of sloppiness. She doesn't seem all that engaged. I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt toDay I think but would like to hear a lot more from her toMorrow (if she's still alive, that is).

Lottie seems much more subdued that I remember her. Which is kinda worrying but I'm not comfortable voting her. Not

I'm be tempted to try Inzil. Not because I really suspect him, but rather because his identity could shed some light of yesterDay's voting.

Legate is, alright I guess. Seems genuine.

Boro seems a bit off though. He usually talk of himself all the time and has, well, has has now too hasn't he? Still, something unusual about him. Should be more direct perhaps?

But to be honest I feel pretty good about most of the loud people. My vote may well fall on one of the quiet submarine-types. Pretty sure you'd find at least one, probably two wolves among them.

Hm. Must eat something..

EDIT :x'ed with 2 Shasta and a Boro

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by skip spence

Lottie seems much more subdued that I remember her. Which is kinda worrying but I'm not comfortable voting her.

Yeah, with the big huge games I usually take a couple of Days to find my feet. You'll get her back eventually, I hope. :/

Now then. Legate and Mac bother me, but not in a wolf sense. Legate because the tone of his posts seems way different than usual, but I don't think he'd do that as a wolf. Mac because, despite the logic and all, he's misrepresenting some people. Not enough so that people would notice much, but enough to draw flawed conclusions with if he wanted to. He'd in a good spot for a wolf to be in, but I don't suspect him personally - it's more of a "if he were a wolf we'd be in so much trouble" sort of thing.

So, since neither of those two are really worth voting, I suppose I'll probably go with Kit so that the option is there if we decide to lynch her and see where her Hunt leaves us and whatnot.

++Kit

I might get a chance to pop in again, might not.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by skip spence

haha, relax people, just a joke, I'm not the hunter.

For those who didn't play in Lommy's game a few months back, I falsely and foolishly claimed to be the hunter in that game.

Now I actually think I have been in that game, but it didn't occur to me. Honestly, you've got to be crazy!!! We have enough problems as it is. I almost voted Kit actually at the close of my post. So!!!

Therefore, scratch all that I have said in my previous post. So Kit is the Hunter, we should decide what to do with her, and skip, now I wonder if you would dare to joke like this as a Wolf. But right now... bleagh!

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by skip spence

For those who didn't play in Lommy's game a few months back, I falsely and foolishly claimed to be the hunter in that game.

Oh please don't remind me, trying to figure out whether I should come forward (as the real hunter) was so stressful, and then we lost because I went and trusted evil!Boro and evil!Nog, and revealed! Yes, I still hold a grudge.


I'm afraid I won't be able to come back after this post. I couldn't get on during my first two classes, and know for sure I won't be able to for my last (which starts very soon), and I have to go straight to work immediately after class, where I have no internet. So toDay sucks for me, I apologise. For the next week the Days fall on the days I don't have school, so this should be my only bad Day for participation.


Anyway, I've just lightly skimmed. I believe Kit, cause there is rarely ever a reason for someone to claim hunter when they aren't (though there are exceptions *cough*skip*cough*), and though I'm strongly against Hunter reveals, this one is understandable since she can't play anymore. Obviously lynching her would be a waste, she'll be modkilled soon enough so I say we don't worry about it.

And Agan, I did think you were too obvious to be the Cobbler, but then you drew attention to Sally's thing and that would be a smart thing for the Cobbler to do (make it seem innocent, like you're just suspicious of Sally and trying to bring her down, but really letting the wolves know that you've seen it and are planning to go through with it). I know some people think that for it to work the Cobbler would have to leave a hint, but I don't think that's necessarily true. If enough attention was brought to that plan then the Cobbler and Wolves may have just assumed that the other was thinking of doing it. And mentioning it at the very end of the Day when it's intense and someone is being lynched, that brings a lot of attention to it.

Guh, I have to go. How bad would it be for me not to vote? Cause I don't have time to read thoroughly and make an educated decision, and Agan isn't really an option since I'm more confused, rather than suspicious, about her, and really just that one post of hers looks really bad to me, otherwise she seems normal-ish. So, I won't. Sorry, I just wouldn't know who to go for, too much to read in the 5 minutes before I have to leave. Good luck!

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

"No real hinting"? Why not? "More direct"? Oh yes, you could have been: you could have done the thing you later rebuked Sally for. That's EXACTLY what I had in mind when saying that you did not drop any direct hint. For that matter, I also didn't say I think you are innocent. It did not make me suspect you, and that's a huge difference, as you can surely understand.

No real hinting because the baddies didn't yet have any information that we don't. And I suppose that's fair enough, although I would never ever had said so, regardless of my role (innocent me doesn't want to give the baddies ideas while an evil me doesn't want the attention).

Good question. You know, your sharp observations in this post about what the Wolves would think about the Cobbler and so on are actually so sharp that I am starting to think that you have been thinking about it a great deal yourself in your quest to find an ally.

Ahaha! Like, what? Seriously though, I love that comment. It just proves what I always knew: I think like a wolf.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I'm not sure I agree with you. That Sallywagon sprang up awfully late in the day, to be purely-innocent driven.

And why would the wolves encourage lynching someone who just said something more helpful to them than anything else that had been said? Could they really afford it? Personally, I think there was a better reason to lynch sally than Pitch, Nessa or Zil anyway. If you think there was a wolf involved, give some more reasoning. It's way too easy to just randomly cast suspicion on a group of people like that.

Legate's confusion about the skip-hunter issue actually makes me feel a lot better about him. It looks genuine.

By the way Boro, I just remembered I also had a dream Folwren and I went into a national park in America. There were lots of absolutely gorgeous tigers, and suddenly one of them killed a screaming woman after a (very) brief chase. It bit her head off.