Gandalf Vs. The Witch King

[Dakêsîntrah]

Let me add that I will give credit to Peter in at least trying to avoid the cliché depiction of the all mighty good guy wizard who fears nothing!

I mean, c'mon, since Tolkien's day, this has been portrayed at least a dozen times in other fantasy works and movies.

It would be about as interesting as Superman taking on the world minus the kryptonite!

This is why Batman's so much more immensely popular: Since his mortal flaws are sometimes exposed, it makes for an interesting showdown with the villains.

The old man is merely a suit of Olorin, the real being, and I could care less if the mortal body might be seen quailing.

To me, it's not a matter of who's superior, it's really an analysis on the nature of Olorin's body/spirit.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Dakêsîntrah

Let me add that I will give credit to Peter in at least trying to avoid the cliché depiction of the all mighty good guy wizard who fears nothing!

That might have been a good idea had we not seen this same wizard fight a Balrog while falling through the earth.

I mean, c'mon, since Tolkien's day, this has been portrayed at least a dozen times in other fantasy works and movies.

Agreed, though I have two issues with that: (1) you *expect* a wizardly bearded figure to be the one to 'save the day,' (or at least I would say current culture might) and (2) this wizard is *Gandalf*, meaning that it's just not some generic wizard but one we know all about.

It would be about as interesting as Superman taking on the world minus the kryptonite!

Cool analogy! Have you ever seen the movie 'Superman II?' Regardless, Superman's weakness in that movie isn't kryptonite, but his feelings for the lowly humans that infest the planet. The three bad superbeings use Superman's attachment to Lois Lane to get at him.

Could anyone think of a way where we would avoid the wizard cliche, have Gandalf portrayed as powerfully as he is in the books *and* yet allow for his character not to overshine the story in this kryptoniteless world?

This is why Batman's so much more immensely popular: Since his mortal flaws are sometimes exposed, it makes for an interesting showdown with the villains.

That part was played by 'take off his head' Aragorn...

The old man is merely a suit of Olorin, the real being, and I could care less if the mortal body might be seen quailing.

But what about all of the 'drivel' he spouted to Pippin? About 'this' not being the end?

Originally Posted by Gandalf and Pip (from the RotK script)

ANGLE ON: GANDALF and PIPPIN sit on stone steps . . . Both covered in sweat and grime, bone-weary from fighting, spirits and hearts bruised . . .
PIPPIN looks towards the WOODEN GATES at which a NUMBER of SOLDIERS continue to build a BARRICADE . . .

PIPPIN
(quiet) I didn't think it would end this way . . .

GANDALF looks at the SMALL HOBBIT a beat.

GANDALF
(gently) End? No, the journey doesn't end here.

PIPPIN looks up at GANDALF, questioningly . . . .

GANDALF (cont'd)
Death is just another path, one that we all must take.

ANGLE ON: GANDALF looks down to see PIPPIN looking up at him with fear in his eyes . . .

GANDALF (cont'd)
(remembering) The grey rain curtain of this world rolls back and all turns to silver glass . . .
(to himself) and then you see it . . .

ANGLE ON: GANDALF breaks off, lost in reverie . . .

PIPPIN
What, Gandalf? See what?

GANDALF
White shores ... And beyond . . . A far green country under a swift sunrise.

PIPPIN stares up at the OLD WIZARD'S FACE, softened, quiet and full of peace . . .

PIPPIN
(quiet) Well, that isn't so bad.

GANDALF
(gently) No . . . No, it isn't.

BOOM!

ANGLE ON: GANDALF and PIPPIN'S faces turn as the WOODEN DOORS shudder under another BLOW.

Again, to me it's a matter of consistency. Either Gandalf believes what he said, and so would be at peace, or not.