Galadriel's Ban

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Originally Posted by Galin

For possible clarity, the "addition" here is not simply that Galadriel passed over with Melian, but as I quoted above: "We have dwelt here since the mountains were reared and the sun was young [addition] And I have dwelt here with him since the days of dawn, when I passed over the seas with Melian of Valinor; and ever together we have fought the long defeat."

Which, to my mind, all together is a precursor of the final form published in Fellowship: "He has dwelt in the West since the days of dawn, and I have dwelt with him years uncounted, for ere the fall of Nargothrond or Gondolin I passed over the mountains, and together through ages of the world we have fought the long defeat."

So as I currently see things, the Melian idea, whenever it was added, still drops out in the revision which takes us to the form published in 1955 -- in other words, it appears to have been added before the final version is reached, and is rejected in any case.

Anyway WCH, I assume by your remark that you agree that the ban (that you find in Nerwen's songs) and the Melian concept could belong to enough of a separate time in the draft phase, and thus could represent separate ideas . . . otherwise, if the songs "go with" the Melian idea, arguably it becomes harder to explain why Galadriel should be banned if she isn't even part of the Rebellion.


Or is my reading of the TOI description off in some way? I've simplified it a bit, but that's the sequence as I see it . . . so far.

I'm having trouble coming up with a timeline, mentally, although I suppose it could be straightened out by someone a bit more familiar with the textual history (Bill Fliss has a big chart covering all of Marquette's holdings). The problem I have is that the "Melian passage" appears to post-date the "over the mountains" version, as if it was a passing idea for a change which was then rejected. Or, another possibility, it is an idea Tolkien had post-publication.

Part of the problem here is dating the typescript referenced here. Tolkien did not have much of the LR typed by someone else, nor usually close to the time of writing (except for Book IV, so that CT could be sent a copy). Most chapters remained in manuscript fair copy until he typed the whole thing himself between late 1948 and late 1949- and then a second time in 1952-55.