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Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page |
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#1 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Tol Morwen
Posts: 369
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But...ladies and gentlemen, we DO have "Concerning... 'The Hoard'"!
That is, as of last month from an auction - it was sold for c. 150,000$ from what I've heard. The auction website has actually posted images of the manuscripts, and a brave soul has already attempted to tackle the mess that is Tolkien's handwriting! I will link both the auction website and the transcript here, and oh boy does it not disappoint! The manuscript images: https://historical.ha.com/itm/books/...Popular-112917 The transcript: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...ISmd8laFM/edit
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#2 | |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
Posts: 3,971
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Quote:
hS
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Have you burned the ships that could bear you back again? ~Finrod: The Rock Opera |
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#3 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Tol Morwen
Posts: 369
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Sure, make a thread if you want - I'm not really active on the forum anyway, I just remembered this project and wanted to share my find (which I stumbled upon on r/tolkienfans).
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#4 |
King's Writer
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,721
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Okay, so in view of what is found in the actual text of Concerning ... 'The Hoard', it seems we sought all the time an answer for the wrong question: The question is not, how to get rid of the Outlaws? It is rather how to get rid of the constant fighting in Menegroth?
And only Tolkiens first answer was to get rid of the Outlaws and then he changed his mind (because what he had done destroyed the gesture of Húrin) and skipt the fight between the Dwarven smiths and the Elves. And by that making the Dwarves even more respectable and Thingol even more foolish and spell-driven. It is a pity Christopher Tolkien did not know that text when he published Sill77; HoME and probably B&L. And the next arcaine question is how the dating of Concerning ... 'The Hoard' is relative to Text X. However that short text will bring a lot of change in this chapter and some details for others. Maybe it can wake some new intrest in this now very long resting project! Respectfully, Findegil Last edited by Findegil; 08-08-2022 at 10:06 AM. |
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#5 |
Wight
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 248
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Hello everyone. I already explained in The Books section that regarding the manuscript, I have doubts about its dating.
The doubt arises mainly from the mention of the Sons of the Valar, in 1964. Either way, this changes the story treatment of The Ruin of Doriath. Mainly regarding the outlaws and Thingol's death. But we continue, or at least I continue, with the doubt of who the Nauglamir was made for, Thingol or Finrod. We continue with the question of text X (or the conversation with his father X). That could have been written or made after 1964. My initial proposal would be to adopt the plot line of C..TH, adapting the BoLT text, but keeping the authorship of the Nauglamir for Finrod. I would, without any other evidence, to give CT the credibility it deserves. What is your opinion? Greetings |
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#6 |
King's Writer
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,721
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We have seen JRR Tolkien before using phrases like 'the Sons of the Valar' long after he had abonded them in other texts. But anyway, what would that change in our weighing of the text? It is still by fare the latest text we have, beside some snipets here and there, like Text X.
Respectfully Findegil |
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#7 |
Wight
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 248
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Yes. Of course that doesn't matter at all for our purposes. It was just a question to consider.
In any case, what do you think of my proposition, keeping the Nauglamír for Finrod, having no other evidence than the credibility of CT, and assuming that text X is after 1964, which may well be possible. Greetings |
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