Tol-in-Gaurhoth CXV: On the Borders of Mirkwood - Game Thread

[A Little Green]

I’m not sure what to make of how convinced Mac suddenly is that Form is a wolf – convinced enough to base the rest of his judgments on players on whether or not they could be fellows with Form. Is this just the BG kill, or am I missing something from earlier? My notes say he had Form down as “no read whatsoever” still yesterDay. Or is it like what Shasta said about Form being the runner-up both Days and surviving? (That's a fair point, incidentally.)

Originally Posted by Mac

Form -> Kath - if you were to interpret this vote very sinisterly, Form could see himself in danger of being lynched from afar and tries to back the first best choice to compete with him. The suspicion of Kath he voiced before sounds a bit generic.
…
Kath -> Nilp - Form's vote for Kath makes it fairly unlikely that they are wolves together, so that makes this vote look fairly good.

This doesn’t make any sense. Like, the argument against Form here is fair enough, and I agree it makes Form and Kath look like a fairly unlikely pairing, but how does that alone make Kath’s vote look good? Why is a scenario where Kath is a wolf and Form isn’t not an option? This then continues with -

Originally Posted by Mac

Pitch -> Nogrod - this is the interesting Nog vote, I think. Pitch only mentions him in an early-day list of suspects and other than that keeps his options very wide open. Also, in #316 he mentions all that had votes at the time except Kath. So this makes me think they may be wolves together. Then again, I don't actually think Kath is that suspicious, so these two pieces don't fit right now. Unless if Form is innocent, but that's too many ifs right here.

Again, I agree with the basic conclusion here – Pitch’s vote looks possibly the sketchiest of the Nog-lot, especially in connection with Kath. But again, Mac refutes this with how this would only fit if Form was innocent, but that’s too many ifs. Like, where did this come from? How is "if Form is innocent" more of a stretch than "if Form is a wolf"?

Originally Posted by Mac

Brinn -> Nogrod - been after him all day, so due to consistency this vote is less suspicious than it would otherwise be
…
Lastly, while it's possible that Hui and Lottie made Brinn the medium for the entertainment value, but I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt (yes, I know, they're just ordos, too) and will give her a pass for toDay, not that I was really suspicious of her to begin with.

Unrelated to Form, but I don’t agree with these conclusions about Brinn at all and in fact this makes me somewhat uneasy. First of all, I don’t think consistency equals innocence – a Brinnwolf would be just as likely to remain consistent with her earlier case against Nog as an innocent Brinn. It’s perfectly easy for a wolf to be consistent, so I don’t think Brinn’s consistence alone is a sign of anything. And second, if you don’t suspect Brinn, that’s absolutely fine, but I don’t get why the Medium thing is an argument for giving her a free pass. Even if the dead thread weren’t trolling (I love it if they were btw ), they don’t know anything more than we do. Last game, we had a dead wolf in there pretty early on, so there was a possibility the dead thread had some information we didn’t (ie. he might have let something slip). Here, unfortunately our dead thread consists of ordos, who know just as little as everyone here.

Originally Posted by Sally

Brinn's vote logic yesterDay looks very good to me. Granted, if it turns out Form is a wolf, I may have to rethink that (talking about voting him and then going back on it), but I understand where she's coming from; if your top candidate becomes a viable lynch target, you take the opportunity. All in all, I feel good about her.

In a similar vein, I agreed with a lot of things in Sally’s list but this bit not so much. I do agree an innocent Brinn could have done that, but a Brinnwolf who had suspected Nog previously could do it just as well – especially if Form is a wolf. And that’s curious as well actually – Sally and Mac both suspect Form, but where Mac interprets everything based on whether it tallies with Form being a wolf to the point it looks odd, Sally seems to do the opposite to the point it looks odd too. This makes me wonder about Sally – the bit about Brinn looking good but how she might have to reconsider if Form turns out a wolf as her vote could have been to save Form, doesn’t make sense if Form really is her top suspect like she says in that same post. Like, if she genuinely thinks Form is the likeliest wolf here, I’d think looking at his possible fellows would factor into her judgments more than as an aside.

Originally Posted by Sally

I also think Pitch's exasperation at BG's gifted ponderings looks solid, and Kath doing the same makes me less suspicious of her by about a smidge. Then again, that could be the frustration of any experienced player regardless of role, so I'm trying not to jump to conclusions.

I thought the same initially, but then, I agree that this kind of frustration can be genuine regardless of role. It would also be an easy way for a wolf to score a brownie point. So I don’t think we can read too much into it either way.

And back on the subject of the Nogwagon (that sounds like a food truck btw) - we shouldn't forget Legate, either.

Originally Posted by Legate

Whoa, this got really wide really fast.

I am also not entirely sure about where that Kathwagon came from. I mean, her vote was potentially incriminating (even though I would argue there are others in worse positions). And I am triple not sure what to make of BG's continuing vote for Form. It seems to me like BG is just sliding with the obvious.

Maybe I’m biased because I do think Kath is suspicious, but the bit about her here makes me uneasy. Kath had two votes by this point, so calling it a Kathwagon is stretching it - though would make sense if they were wolves together, either because votes for a fellow would look more threatening so he might think of it as a wagon already, or because he had an interest in presenting votes for Kath as sinister. And then there’s this –

Originally Posted by Legate

Why does it always come down to last minutes like this... no matter what one does.

This looks a lot like hand-washing. I can’t believe I’m spelling this out, but if you don’t like all the action happening literally in the last 10 minutes, how about – vote sooner? It’s not like some force of nature we’re helpless against, and painting it as such is an easy way to take less responsibility for one’s vote. As in, cross-posting with half the village so you can later claim you had no idea your vote was part of a bandwagon instead of an individual vote with no consequence. This isn’t just Legate, either – I’m a bit worried about the last-minute voting and how easy it is to hide there. With votes more spread out and less cross-posting, people are forced to be more accountable for their votes as they’ll know what’s going on when they’re voting and how their vote impacts the overall situation.

[A Little Green]

Quick list, then I need to get back to work -

Brinniel – I’m not sure what to make of her. Her D1 vote was a very safe one for BG, D2 she was the nail in Nog’s coffin, though with all that chaos yesterDay I can’t be sure she actually knew she was. I also don’t like how both Sally and Mac seem happy to give her a pass because she’s consistent.

Formendacil – Gives me a headache. I still think the Cobbler theory is a possibility, given his discussion of Gifteds and potential Cobbler-hinting early on D1. I haven’t seen anything particularly wolfy from him per se, but I agree with Shasta that there’s a possible pattern to him ending up as the runner-up but not lynched twice in a row now.

Kath – Possibly my best lead at the moment. Her D1 Huin vote is still pretty suspicious in how it was orchestrated, and a vote for Nilp D2 doesn’t make her look any better – it was the second vote for Nilp so can’t be called an outright throwaway, but also Nilp wasn’t a very likely lynchee so keeps her nose clean. I don’t like how careful she’s playing – I mean, she’s always careful to some degree, but this looks a bit too deliberate.

Legate – Another possible wolf, especially given the Lottie kill and the odd comments at the end of yesterDay. Not sure what to make of his interaction with Kath, though – his talk of a Kathwagon yesterDay looked sketchy, but there was a bit on D1 where he misremembered BG’s vote for Form as following Kath instead of Huin. This would be an unlikely mistake to make if they were fellows, as I’d expect him to naturally keep tabs on what his fellows do and who they vote for.

Macalaure – Another headache. I’ve agreed with him a lot over this game, but I’m not at all comfortable with his posting toDay and how he’s suddenly convinced Form is a wolf. I’ll reserve judgment until I hear back from him though as I think I might have misunderstood something.

Nilp – I feel like I’ve gotten a better read of him since he stopped trying to commit suicide, and I’m not too worried at the moment.

Pitchwife – Definitely want to take a look at him toDay. I don’t like how he was suspected on D1 (including by yours truly) and somehow managed to slip by fairly unnoticed yesterDay. His Nog vote isn’t doing him any favours either, especially if Kath is a wolf.

Rikae – Like Nilp, I feel somewhat better about her. I had a quick read through her posts after yesterDay as she was involved in both lynches, but her reasoning looks pretty genuine to me. Additionally, I somehow think a Rikaewolf would play either more careful (as in, steering away from being implicated in innocent lynches twice in a row) or more confrontational/manipulative.

Sally – I’m getting slightly uneasy about her. Her list post, especially regarding Form and Brinn, seems somewhat contrived - as in, the logic looks off from an innocent POV. Nothing more substantial yet, though.

Shasta – I like to think I’m okay at reading him, and still get more or less an innocent Shasta -vibe.

Lommy – Also starting to worry me. She’s somehow more slippery and careful than usual, and pretty much under everyone’s radar. Part of this might just be due to her being around less than usual, but I don’t think that’s all of it. Another one I’d love to read through toDay if I have time.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Checking in to say that I'm trying to walk off a terrible headache. I'll be back once the brief rest and NSAIDs kick in. Don't lynch me while I'm gone, please--do it when I'm around.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Quoting as I go...

Originally Posted by Brinniel

This was the title of post #253. I could see the wolves thinking it a seer hint. But it seems a little too obvious.

This definitely could be read as Seer-hint, but exactly, wouldn't that be too obvious for a real Seer? And BG was definitely far from uncontroversial. And I think about half the village suspected her to a degree, so unless they had really good reason, why kill her?

And if the Wolves thought her a Seer, her list of potential Wolves is far from clear. It includes Nog, who's a known innocent, and while Form is there in a nice position, he's also there as Cobbler.

Originally Posted by Brinniel

Her analyzing gifteds was odd. Could the wolves have thought (or hoped) that she dreamt and outed a gifted Shasta?

This could make sense except it already operates with one "what-if" condition. It might really be that the Wolves just thought BG to be a Seer based on the "Will I dream, Dave" thing.

Originally Posted by Formendacil

I assume all the returning players went through this last game: does the fact that the Dead Thread chose Brinn as their medium suggest any endorsement of Brinn or is it strictly that the vote she was making is what they wanted to see voted?

Funny thing now that you mention the last game... I was wondering why the Dead chose Brinn and one rather simple, yet perfectly logical solution is that they are simply continuing the trend from previous game, where giving Brinn votes from beyond the grave was essentially the main pastime of the Dead. (And I guess maybe that's what Rikae is referring to when calling it "epic".)

Otherwise: there are almost too many questions in yesterDay's vote. Partly because of its spread. Okay, I see some of them started to be answered... of those that didn't, I also do not see where did Rikae's vote for Nog exactly come from. Care to elaborate? Rikae has become increasingly untransparent to me. Same goes for Pitch's vote, only he's been untransparent already before. Why Nog and not somebody else?

Another random observation when looking at the voting list: what's the Mac-Nilp thing? Looks like the two are having a private thing of their own going on there. I get the reasoning of Mac's vote, even though to be fair, if I go back to his reasoning before the actual vote, the original suspicion is rather random. Care to elaborate? Nilp's reasoning is interesting to say the least, but I don't see why would a Wolf cast a vote like that. Unless this is some Wolf-on-Wolf while the village is concentrated on something else.

Originally Posted by A Little Green

Maybe I’m biased because I do think Kath is suspicious, but the bit about her here makes me uneasy. Kath had two votes by this point, so calling it a Kathwagon is stretching it

At that point, I was first concerned that you said you prioritised Kath over Nog, because Nog seemed to me as clearer option back then. That Form was the second on the wagon did not make it look better in my eyes, it felt like Wolves were pushing to save fellow Nog (obviously now we know otherwise. Since I still don't trust Form very much, it might be worth it to go back to that point and try to figure out what was happening. But you are right that it may be nothing since it, indeed, was no big wagon at that time. But at that point, it did not look like that - it could have been the start of a big wagon).

[A Little Green]

Originally Posted by Legate

And BG was definitely far from uncontroversial. And I think about half the village suspected her to a degree, so unless they had really good reason, why kill her?

I actually thought the opposite – BG did cause controversy but towards the end of the Day I remember the consensus seeming more like “she wouldn’t do this if she was a wolf”. That Legate remembers it so differently is very interesting, and I now feel like I should check back and see which one of us is right! Admittedly I’m not sure if that’s a very fruitful line of inquiry.

Originally Posted by Legate

At that point, I was first concerned that you said you prioritised Kath over Nog, because Nog seemed to me as clearer option back then. That Form was the second on the wagon did not make it look better in my eyes, it felt like Wolves were pushing to save fellow Nog (obviously now we know otherwise. Since I still don't trust Form very much, it might be worth it to go back to that point and try to figure out what was happening. But you are right that it may be nothing since it, indeed, was no big wagon at that time. But at that point, it did not look like that - it could have been the start of a big wagon).

This still doesn’t make sense. How could the two-vote Kathwagon be an attempt to save Nog when Nog didn’t have any votes at the time? Sure, Nog was under quite a bit of fire throughout the Day, but at that point there were already people saying he’s starting to look more like a frustrated innocent. As for why I picked Kath over Nog – I thought there was a good case against both of them, but there was also a decent argument for Nog’s innocence (ie. his confusion about wolf PM rules on D1), whereas I couldn’t think of as solid an argument for Kath’s. Now I wish I’d articulated this better yesterDay, though I’m not sure if it would have actually swayed any of the Nog voters.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I've been trying to read back on some of the people I have less read on, starting with Nilp and while I was at it, I also took a look at Mac. Since I'm doing so in-between breaks at work, it's a quest for several hours, but since it seems quiet, hopefully I'll manage to finish it before it starts to be busy again...

Nilp started the first Day by self-voting followed by Cobbler boots and talking about "if I were a Nightmare Wolf, I would..." After that, it went gradually more thoughtful and reasonable (mostly, at least whenever he got to say something non-banter-y). The second Day, he had some very reasonable points, followed by suspicion of Mac - on rather random grounds, however, basically, by way of assuming that the Wolves had to be one of Nog, me and Mac - that far I can still follow - and then concluding that it was Mac without much of a reasoning. I would like to hear more from him.

Mac - looking back, he was actually very "happy-go-lucky" at the start of the first Day, later got to a more analytical mode. This all happened with not so much activity. Pitch was one he suspected, ending with voting him. Seemed very convinced that Hui was "at most a Cobbler". I would not think a Wolf-Mac would make such clear statements, but then again, anything is possible.
On Day 2, he had reasonable points again. Overall, he seemed convinced about quite a few people being cobblerish at one point or another. Had some back-and-forth with Shasta that eventually ended with him accepting Shasta's clarification. Eventually went with voting Nilp out of his suspects, which I would still like to hear about.
In this light, perhaps the most incriminating part is that both his votes were in such a way that went "off the mainstream". Mac can definitely be highly individualistic, but it could also be a good cover not to get involved in anything incriminating. I am still wary of the way he sorta floats about.

Overall Nilp remains in my yellow zone for now, and I will definitely wait until when he reappears to hear more from him. Similarly, Mac remains in my orange zone.

I would like to still look back at the posts of people like Rikae and Pitchwife, who remain in my center-grey zone, or even Greenie, whom I'm overall getting good vibe about but perhaps should try to look freshly at. But somehow not sure if I will have time since this took so long... now to see if anyone posted...

EDIT: I see I'm x-ing with Mac and Rikae themselves. Let's see if I have time to read and respond now...

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Mac, you might be even more annoyed to hear that you're basically the victim of a poorly-told joke.

I thought to myself, if these furballs infesting this once-peaceful village want to go after obvious Seer candidates, I'll give them one.

So I looked for the most oblique, but still somewhat defensible angle of attack against someone otherwise unsuspected. Let them think I dreamt of this villager and am trying desperately to make a case. You happened to be the one on the receiving end of it. I regret nothing, btw, except the fact that I set traps around my house last NIGHT, but no one showed up.

Why? Was I too obvious? Too oblique? Or, the most apparent reason, barking up the wrong tree? This seems the most likely explanation. So Mac, I basically take back what I said yesterDAY.

Now, I have a problem. Since I used up my supplies setting up those traps, my house is kinda unprotected toNIGHT. If I live to see tomorrow, then I'll have a more proper greeting for for any fanged home invaders, but I'm not sure if I'd last that long.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Eeh? Don't get me wrong, you look innocent to me, but I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean.

I feel like I'm confusing myself right now and don't have a clear picture. I'm seeing fangs all over Legate's last post and I can't even begin to wrap my mind around Nilp right now. I feel like I need to back off a bit and get a clear fresh look in a while.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

I also do not see where did Rikae's vote for Nog exactly come from. Care to elaborate? Rikae has become increasingly untransparent to me. Same goes for Pitch's vote, only he's been untransparent already before. Why Nog and not somebody else?

Sorry if it was unclear. I had posted about my suspicions of him earlier and at that point it looked like my top suspect wouldn't be on the table unless I acted rapidly.

Originally Posted by Mac

Reading my own sentence again here, I'm not making sense. If the waggon was wolf-led, it of course points to Form, he was the only one in there.

Eeh? Don't get me wrong, you look innocent to me, but I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean.

Originally Posted by Form

In each case, I've voted relatively early (none of this "last fifteen minutes" cluster that Legate wrings his hands over)--but I have added to existing waggons: both of which would have saved a Known Innocent had the village followed. Granted, there's no guarantee a different Innocent might not have died, but we KNOW Known Innocents did.

So, I submit: if I am a Cobbler, am I a good one?

Really? You voted cleanly, so you're not a cobbler? I agree, though, you are not ...

[Thinlómien]

Here!

First impressions: side-eyeing Nog voters very hard. There is a very fishy reek to the whole business.

Very surprised to see BG gone because I seem to recall her thinking there was no seer in the whole game?? Did the wolves think that was a bizarre bluff? She must have been onto something then.

Now off to read and comment.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Rikae

I'm about to go have dinner, but I just wanted to say:

Hui and Loslote,

THAT WAS EPIC

...what? Are you the cobbler perhaps?

Re: Brinn's helpful post about BG: ok I can see why she was thought the seer now but it's still weird to me. Form looks a little dubious as a result, but I'm hesitating to jump on it because Nog was on par with him. Unless they thought BG had dreamed of Form and was just jumping into conclusions about Nog protecting him?

I would also give credit to BG fairly arbitrarily naming Shasta as the ranger - it's quite a far-fetched conclusion to make as an ordo so I would understand if the wolves thought BG had inside information. Of course, she also named Nog as the beast hunter which was NOT true, and the wolves knew that was wrong too by the time they killed her. So in conclusion, I think this kill makes Shasta look more innocent than not.

Originally Posted by Brinn

And if you are a wolf, your packmates may have found you worth sacrificing for this reason (and especially if you are the NW).

What she said.

Originally Posted by Mac

Not much to say about the night kill. "Will I dream Dave" plus leaving out the seer in her gifted discussion... Yeah, maybe it's a too obvious hint, as Brinn said, but it would be near negligent of the wolves to discount it for that.

Given that I still can't follow the wolf logic on BG and I'm not the only one and here Mac goes soft defending how resonable it is... makes me suspicious of Mac. Are you offended that we think your kill pick was stupid?

Originally Posted by Mac

Lastly, while it's possible that Hui and Lottie made Brinn the medium for the entertainment value, but I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt (yes, I know, they're just ordos, too) and will give her a pass for toDay, not that I was really suspicious of her to begin with.

Why on earth would you give someone a pass just because two dead ordos decided to endorse her?

Originally Posted by Brinn

I took a look through Legate's posts since I said I would. His posting seems less frequent than last game, but I like the content of his posts, probably because I agree with a lot of it. I don't really buy into Nogrod's theory that Lottie died because the wolves thought she dreamed of an evil Legate. Sure it's possible, but I still find it more likely that they thought her a seer that dreamed of Hui. Her suspicion of Legate came late in the Day, and I think a Legatewolf would more likely risk another Day than immediately kill her as a possible seer.

Pitch's vote was the most bandwaggony of the Nog votes and looking through his posts, I'm not clear on the reasons for his vote and why he suspected him. Mac did make a good point that it was interesting he didn't consider voting Kath considering she was one of his top suspects yesterDay.

I did mention before that Formy appeared to be more cobblerish...but based on last Night's kill, I wonder if he's in fact the NW.

Agreeing with basically all of this. (Which isn't necessarily comforting? It's always creepy when someone else in ww thinks too similarly to you.) Anyway agreed that Pitch's bandwagony vote was weird. Doesn't make me think him any less of a cobbler, for one.

Originally Posted by Shasta

I would have expected something like Pitch, Kath, or Form, but Nog I thought was fairly solidly good. Hm. Makes me wonder how evil-driven that execution was.

I bet the lovely sofa I'm sitting on that there was at least one wolf in the nogwagon.

Originally Posted by Shasta

Form - honestly, with as much suspicion as he's been getting, the fact that he hasn't been executed yet speaks to him being saved. The traction seems to be there, but it dies off at the last second.

My thoughts EXACTLY. Also the last Night kill and him hiding behind stastics to make all his arguments feel very dubious to me.

Re: Greenie's post about Mac and Form: iiinteresting. A Mac-Form pack wouldn't really surprise me very much. I also agree with Greenie about Brinn's consistency scarcely being a point in favour (if not a point *against* her either.)

Originally Posted by Greenie

This looks a lot like hand-washing. I can’t believe I’m spelling this out, but if you don’t like all the action happening literally in the last 10 minutes, how about – vote sooner? It’s not like some force of nature we’re helpless against, and painting it as such is an easy way to take less responsibility for one’s vote. As in, cross-posting with half the village so you can later claim you had no idea your vote was part of a bandwagon instead of an individual vote with no consequence. This isn’t just Legate, either – I’m a bit worried about the last-minute voting and how easy it is to hide there. With votes more spread out and less cross-posting, people are forced to be more accountable for their votes as they’ll know what’s going on when they’re voting and how their vote impacts the overall situation.

Hear, hear! These accesible-for-most deadlines are lovely, but they do require a bit more coordination from the village. A thought: if you're an innocent with a strong suspicion, you should rather vote EARLIER because that's when you can affect who ends up as a chopping block contester. That's what I've been doing these two gmes mostly - alas not always with the best results. (Made me think of what Rikae said yesterDay about categorising ww players in terms of resilience, persuasiveness and perception - I'm afraid I would score fairly high on resilience and persuasiveness but not very high on perception... not really ideal except maybe for a cobbler...)

Originally Posted by Greenie

I actually thought the opposite – BG did cause controversy but towards the end of the Day I remember the consensus seeming more like “she wouldn’t do this if she was a wolf”. That Legate remembers it so differently is very interesting, and I now feel like I should check back and see which one of us is right! Admittedly I’m not sure if that’s a very fruitful line of inquiry.

My two cents is "she looked like a confused ordo and I thought the whole village agreed", which is probably why the kill baffles me.

Going to cross-post with everyone after my last...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

He latched on to the "if the wolves thought Lottie was the seer then why is Mac still alive" thing that Nog brought up (though Nilp says he thought of it on his own), and this was his reason for suspecting me (while Nog didn't take it that far). I thought the reason was bad and suspected him in turn.
Not the most solid of suspicions, and reflecting I might have gotten carried away by being annoyed by it, but it was not one bit random and I don't know how you got that impression.

Fair enough, especially since I just went over the same post of Nilp's. Not sure it proves anything in the bigger picture, but fair enough.

Originally Posted by Macalaure

I have to echo Greenie here, this doesn't make sense.
-The votes for Kath were not unexpected, Greenie's at any rate was predictable.
-The general suspicion of Nogrod seemed to lessen at the time.
-If the wolves find it necessary to start a pre-emptive(!) bandwaggon to save a fellow, they will usually decide that instead it's time for that fellow to catch a bus. Especially with a large pack and on Day2.

Greenie voted for someone she suspected, but she suspected Nog as well and decided against it. I'm talking about how it felt subjectively at that point, when I thought Nog was fishy and suddenly people started turning away from it. The second point is no argument for anything, the third I would argue is pure assumption, since "usually" would exactly differ from pack to pack.
Anyway, all this is purely hypothetical, since now we know Nog was innocent and nobody was saving him.

Originally Posted by Rikae

Sorry if it was unclear. I had posted about my suspicions of him earlier and at that point it looked like my top suspect wouldn't be on the table unless I acted rapidly.

Also fair enough. It was mostly that you were listing many things in your previous post(s), and you sure voiced suspicion of him, but there was no clear "I want to vote Nogrod". But very well.

EDIT: x-ed with Nilp and Mac. Okay, what? But work calls, gh.

[Formendacil]

I'm lurking from work, so this will be short, but....

Isn't Nilp supposed to be LESS confusing after Day 1. This is Day 3. I didn't get a Seer vibe at all, false or not.

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

Isn't Nilp supposed to be LESS confusing after Day 1. This is Day 3. I didn't get a Seer vibe at all, false or not.

I hate to say it, but I totally agree with Form here. If people don't think Lottie looked seerish, I don't understand why Nilp expected anyone to think it of him. Also backing off a suspicion with "sorry, just kidding, as you were" - meh. I don't know.