WW LXXXVII - The Valley Forge - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Galadriel55 · 08-17-2011, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by satansaloser2005

So let me make sure I understand this correctly....

We lynch an ordo. We know we've lynched an ordo.
We lynch a gifted. We know we've lynched a gifted.
We lynch one of the regular Forge members. We know we've lynched a Forge member.
We lynch the KD. We know we've lynched a Forge member.

Is this correct? Because if Foley suddenly decides to stop revealing roles, we would automatically know if it was the KD, so I'm assuming she'll just reveal alignment.

That's right as far as I know. Anyone with a Forge mark (ie wolves and KD) will be called a Forge Member if they die. I think we'll know that it's the SH if she's lynched. If she's killed - obviously.

The fact that the KD's role is not revealed upon death makes things much more difficult for the village. It complicates things for the wolves as well, but they have the benefit of knowing something. Also, they can take information from Nightly conversations. For instance, the KD would try to influence the kill, and a wolf could detect that. But ordinary innocents won't know anything.

Edit: xed with Findy, tp, and sally

the phantom · 08-17-2011, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mith

(To McCaber) So in ch that case why did you jump straight in to complying with it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by McCaber

Because if it WAS allowed to fly, it'd be a great way to get information out. I agreed with it, even though I didn't know if our Moddess Goddess would let it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Um... you know, McCaber, no offence, but I'm not sure that's even an answer. Mith asked you why you jumped straight in without knowing if the plan would be allowed, and you said, "Yes, I did."

No, no, I understand his answer. He was about to leave for the day if I remember correctly, so he wanted to shoot his three suspects out there just in case we did adopt the plan. In other words, he thought it was a plan that could be beneficial and in case we decided to adopt it he wanted to be certain he had done the necessary work to be on board (named suspects). And if we didn't adopt it- oh well, it's not as if his naming of three people hurt anything.

the phantom · 08-17-2011, 11:30 AM

Well, after rereading what I said back in this post still stands generally- not liking Gal55's attitude yesterday and not wishing to lynch certain people.

Anyway, I have decided to swear fealty to Pitch, Boro, McCaber, and Mith. If by my life or death I can... No, scratch the death part, but if I can possibly save you and stay alive at the same time, I will.

I like that Mith spotted Inzil's word choice, as I noticed it too. Sorry lad.

And I also like that Bom and Gal55 both used Werewolf terminology. Makes me feel better about choosing her. Especially seeing that Nerwen also used Werewolf terms and defended Gal55 today.

edit: x-post Pitch

the phantom · 08-17-2011, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pitch

(To Nerwen) And, you know, although I didn't get around to commenting on it at the time, I wasn't at all comfortable with you yesterDay - first fishing for a Moddess-ruling against tp's plan, then, when that wasn't to be got, scattering some passing doubt on (IIRC) Bom, Boro, Eruhen and Findy without really going and committing anywhere, then disappearing.

I didn't really pay attention to those latter points (I'm willing to give some benefit of doubt on disappearances), but I certainly noticed the insistence on a Mod ruling.

It had the smell of someone thinking, "Crap, this could be the end of the line for me. But obviously I can't look outraged and scared. I'll just nicely stave it off with some light resistance and try and get the Moddess to put a stop to it."

Mithalwen · 08-17-2011, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

Anyway, I have decided to swear fealty to Pitch, Boro, McCaber, and Mith. If by my life or death I can... No, scratch the death part, but if I can possibly save you and stay alive at the same time, I will.

I like that Mith spotted Inzil's word choice, as I noticed it too. Sorry lad.

Oh TP I didn't think you cared anymore

Hmmm ok now to get serious again,,,,

the phantom · 08-17-2011, 02:08 PM

Okay Gal55, you're just begging for it now.

The thing is, by claiming surety of Pitch and I being evil you've let me know that you can't possibly be the KD or Sweetheart in contact with the KD (since I'm not evil), and I can't imagine a simple Ordo would express such blind surety at this stage merely in an effort to save herself. An Ordo would have at least some concept of the idea that while she may be innocent she could well be painting more valuable team members (KD or Sweetheart) as evil.

It seems to me that you could be a Forge member banking on us not finding out after your death whether you're the KD and you're hoping people will suspect that's what you were and thus lynch Pitch and I after you're gone.

the phantom · 08-17-2011, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boro

And that last cryptic suspicion...I mean yes, I believe we all see what you're referencing, but in that case, just come out with it. Say it's Pitch and state what you find suspicious about it.

No, no, you shouldn't have done this. Leave it in the dark. Otherwise you're practically begging for modfire.

And speaking of which, Pitch- you didn't need to answer me quite that directly. Like I said, there's thin ice in this village. Tread carefully. If you don't, you run the risk of losing anyone that's on your side, for we are quite near to the point where I'll actually become suspicious if certain individuals aren't modfired (if things continue on the path).

Take it easy.

Boromir88 · 08-17-2011, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

No, no, you shouldn't have done this. Leave it in the dark. Otherwise you're practically begging for modfire.

Yeah, well, you know I'm not one who likes to be shushed, restrained, or if I say something wrong, *poof* I'm gone. I have no tight rope to walk, so whatever.

Rikae · 08-17-2011, 02:24 PM

Yes, tp, I think it's misleading and I consider it unlikely that it's only partially so.

Pitch, when I say I don't think she thought so, that is exactly what I mean... not that she didn't say so. I don't trust you for obvious reasons, therefore I'm rather inclined to trust her.

Mithalwen · 08-17-2011, 11:36 AM

Right so ....13 players 3 straightforward baddies, KD sweetheart, No other gifted... We can't get complacent despite the Day one success.... can't fall into any silly "it is always worth lynching x because they mess with my head nonsense". We have very little margin for error here. And I need to find my notebook.. it was right here before I went out...argh.... I'll be back soon I hope...

Pitchwife · 08-17-2011, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Right so ....13 players 3 straightforward baddies, KD sweetheart, No other gifted...

12 players, Mith. Glirdy dropped out, if I'm not mistaken (see wilwa on Admin thread).

Mithalwen · 08-17-2011, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

12 players, Mith. Glirdy dropped out, if I'm not mistaken (see wilwa on Admin thread).

Yes sorry I meant to mention that as a caveat but unless he is a member of the VF it only makes things tighter....

Inziladun · 08-17-2011, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

I like that Mith spotted Inzil's word choice, as I noticed it too. Sorry lad.

Don't be sorry! I'm not immune to suspicion, no matter how nit-picky.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Call me biased, because it's about me, but I just don't like the look of that suspicion, without it really trying to look like a suspicion. I know Inzil's argument about wolf-on-wolf votes is a normal assumption to make, and I believe Inzil said at the beginning of the day he want to find something in the Bom votes.

SO what I said would have been all right, if it hadn't been you I was talking about?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Granted I didn't indicate I cross-posted, but I rarely ever take the time to edit in a "x-post" unless it's a massively long one. All one has to do is look at the time stamps and see my vote crossed with Inzil's and wilwa's therefor mine coming last in that group of 3 is inconsequential. Inzil pointing out my vote of all of them, being the "last one" and thus "least shiny" looks like a cheap boot-strapping suspicion attempt. (ergo, makes me suspicious of him).

Maybe I'm biased, but this seems like an overdone defense for such a relatively small observation about your vote.

Boromir88 · 08-17-2011, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Maybe I'm biased, but this seems like an overdone defense for such a relatively small observation about your vote.

And there's the 2nd easy boot-strapped suspicion. Come on Inzil you know I'm cooler under pressure. "AHH SOMEONE'S SUSPECTING I MUST DEFEND I MUST DEFEND!"

Since it's coming from me obviously it's going to be a defense, but I'm making the point that your "observation" (if that's how you want to down play it) was flawed because you just saw I was the last of the 3 votes in a cross-voting and determined that mine was the least shiny of all the Bom votes.

08-17-2011, 11:30 AM	#3
the phantom Beloved Shadow Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Stadium Posts: 5,971	Well, after rereading what I said back in this post still stands generally- not liking Gal55's attitude yesterday and not wishing to lynch certain people. Anyway, I have decided to swear fealty to Pitch, Boro, McCaber, and Mith. If by my life or death I can... No, scratch the death part, but if I can possibly save you and stay alive at the same time, I will. I like that Mith spotted Inzil's word choice, as I noticed it too. Sorry lad. And I also like that Bom and Gal55 both used Werewolf terminology. Makes me feel better about choosing her. Especially seeing that Nerwen also used Werewolf terms and defended Gal55 today. edit: x-post Pitch __________________ the phantom has posted. This thread is now important.

08-17-2011, 02:08 PM	#6
the phantom Beloved Shadow Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Stadium Posts: 5,971	Okay Gal55, you're just begging for it now. The thing is, by claiming surety of Pitch and I being evil you've let me know that you can't possibly be the KD or Sweetheart in contact with the KD (since I'm not evil), and I can't imagine a simple Ordo would express such blind surety at this stage merely in an effort to save herself. An Ordo would have at least some concept of the idea that while she may be innocent she could well be painting more valuable team members (KD or Sweetheart) as evil. It seems to me that you could be a Forge member banking on us not finding out after your death whether you're the KD and you're hoping people will suspect that's what you were and thus lynch Pitch and I after you're gone. __________________ the phantom has posted. This thread is now important.

08-17-2011, 11:36 AM	#10
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,461	Right so ....13 players 3 straightforward baddies, KD sweetheart, No other gifted... We can't get complacent despite the Day one success.... can't fall into any silly "it is always worth lynching x because they mess with my head nonsense". We have very little margin for error here. And I need to find my notebook.. it was right here before I went out...argh.... I'll be back soon I hope... __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

08-17-2011, 02:24 PM	#9
Rikae Mellifluous Maia Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: A glade open to the stars, deep in Nan Elmoth Posts: 3,489	Yes, tp, I think it's misleading and I consider it unlikely that it's only partially so. Pitch, when I say I don't think she thought so, that is exactly what I mean... not that she didn't say so. I don't trust you for obvious reasons, therefore I'm rather inclined to trust her.