WW LXXXVII - The Valley Forge - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Mithalwen · 08-17-2011, 05:05 AM

Ah but Nerwen is not the trick to try and play the same regardless of role? Not that I have ever succeeded really with a special role... tends to bring on melt down. Very frustrating to be so suspected for doing exactly what you normally do..though on that occasion I did happen to be a woluf. Others must be able to perceive a difference whatever I think...like what they say about trying to act drunk - people try to fall over forgetting that a drunk is trying very hard to stay upright...anyway digression...

On the subject of Mc Caber is this sort of thing normal? Because it seems odd to me to just jump on other people's work ... I can't obviously object to a G55 vote since I have stated her suspicious but voting after spending what time he had looking at Bom and then seeming to claim the credit for finding G55 suspicious looks fishy to me. Or more accurately wolvish... and I am sorry Phantom I am not going to avoid the term - in this set up we are all dwarves so it is a bit simpler than saying Members of the Valley Forge . I can't help thinking a wolf might jump on TP's plan. As has been pointed wolf on wolf attacks have a different dynamic this game. And to get an early vote in for a fellow wolf might look good too. So hmmm Now I may be being thick but I had assumed the 4 members of the Forge included the KD? IF it doesn't with Glirdan out we certainly can't rest on our laurels. If it does it does leave more scope for there being more than one devil may care wolf.

Rikae... don't know... I find her hard to read...but I seem to remember a certain amount of feistyness so ...not TOO worried.

Inziladun · 08-17-2011, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

"He", not "she". Just letting you know.

Oops. Thanks for the correction.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

It is entirely possible that this particular group of baddies is more likely than any Werewolf pack to purposefully try and lynch one another during the day!!

Now duh, of course we knew the KD was working against them, but what about the others? All they know is that THEY are not the traitor, where as every one of their fellows is potentially a double agent.

I'd already considered this possibility. As McCaber said, though, killing one another by Day is a pretty high-risk tactic, unless they see some very convincing evidence that of them could be the KD. I didn't see anything like that from Bom yesterDay.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

So, without a Seer or Hunter to fear, it seems to me that the logical play would be to kill the other Forge members. And in fact accusing all three of your fellow members might be a smart play as it would make them extremely unlikely to turn against you, as they might fear that you are the KD and killing you would expose them.

But wouldn't that mean the KD was going along with your proposed (and abandoned by consensus) strategy?

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

All right- what do the rest of you think? If I was a Forge member I'd probably kill all the others and win it by myself.

And this goes back to the age-old discussion "I wouldn't do that if I was evil!!"

But if you want an answer, fine. Personally, I don't like the idea of being a lone wolf. Winning that way would seem more chancy.

Mithalwen · 08-17-2011, 06:20 AM

Interesting use of tense there Inzil, don't not wouldn't...?

Inziladun · 08-17-2011, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Interesting use of tense there Inzil, don't not wouldn't...?

And I thought I was a pedant.

Mithalwen · 08-17-2011, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inziladun

And I thought I was a pedant.

Oh you have no idea - I can take most people's pedantry and raise with confidence.

Speculation is the name of the game. And this time it is speculation as it happens.

Pitchwife · 08-17-2011, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Pitch is acting abnormal toDay

You should have been there in Finland to hear Shastawolf cry out: "What happened to Mr Agreeable?!"

But, you know, your attempt there remarkably fits one of the possible reactions I'd expect from a Forger who has just lost a packmate - try to make the best from the loss by spinning it against those who brought xem down. Rikae might qualify as well with her suggestion that Bom could have been the KD - luckily, that seems to be off the table now (and thanks to Nerwen for making a point of what I'd said before her

). Nice try though.

OK, now Foley's new ruling about not revealing the KD at death changes the dynamics a bit. Still, if the Forgers kill one of their own at Night, we won't need a map to identify his role - especially because the Sweetheart, once she's found him, would die along with him: 1 dead Forger + 1 other death = 1 KD. On the other hand, if the Sweetheart is killed, the KD gets his revenge kill and is also as good as revealed.
So, Sweetie-pie, if you're feeling noble and romantic and wouldn't mind risking your life for an innocent victory, you might want to find your Ironfist quickly, if you haven't yet. It depends of course on the numbers, whether we can still afford losing two innocent lives in one kill or not.

What this means for Forger tactics is that I think they'd be more likely to try and get the KD (whoever they think he is) lynched instead of going for him at Night, because they can't know whether the Sweetheart has already found him or not. Which, sadly, means that Forge-on-Forge votes will probably become more frequent now.

What this means for the KD: please be sure to leave hints to help us identify you if you get mislynched, especially if you have reason to think the other Forgers have found you out. You'll have to walk a fine line between hinting and forbidden revealing, but I hope you can think of something.
That said, I expect the other Forgers to try to confuse us by leaving hints of their own. But then, I think the real KD would have tried to hint (to the Sweetheart, if nobody else) well before all this.

Inziladun · 08-17-2011, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

But, you know, your attempt there remarkably fits one of the possible reactions I'd expect from a Forger who has just lost a packmate - try to make the best from the loss by spinning it against those who brought xem down. Rikae might qualify as well with her suggestion that Bom could have been the KD - luckily, that seems to be off the table now (and thanks to Nerwen for making a point of what I'd said before her

). Nice try though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

I can't stay for long or go searching for interactions and etc, but from toDay's posts, Pitchie's case against Rikae feels a bit... fabricated. I'll be back later with my thoughts in full...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

And since I'm here, I can also say that Pitch is acting abnormal toDay, making an elephant out of a fly with Rikae. This isn't supposed to be related to my previous statement - at least in my head, - but they both stand... I think...

It does appear to me that G55's suspicions of Pitch seem rather forced. Pitch was hardly making a "case" against Rikae; just asking for a clarification.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

What this means for Forger tactics is that I think they'd be more likely to try and get the KD (whoever they think he is) lynched instead of going for him at Night, because they can't know whether the Sweetheart has already found him or not. Which, sadly, means that Forge-on-Forge votes will probably become more frequent now.

Sensible, this. However, I still think the Bom voters from yesterDay look pretty good (and yes, I happen to be one of them).

Boromir88 · 08-17-2011, 08:33 AM

Ok, not going to reveal the KD if he dies...hmm, would this mean the other forgers won't know whether their lynched member was the KD or not too?

Nerwen · 08-17-2011, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Ok, not going to reveal the KD if he dies...hmm, would this mean the other forgers won't know whether their lynched member was the KD or not too?

I'd guess not.

Pitchwife · 08-17-2011, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Ok, not going to reveal the KD if he dies...hmm, would this mean the other forgers won't know whether their lynched member was the KD or not too?

I'd guess not.

Me neither - which is of course good for us, as it'll increase mistrust and paranoia among the Forgers, hampering their ability to work as a pack. (Unless the KD somehow blunders and gives himself away to the others - but in this case he won't have much to lose afterwards.)

Wouldn't it be gorgeous if we could just help the Forgers lynch each other for a change? Too nice to come true, I'm afraid.

Anyway. Got to do some grocery shopping now, but I'll be back in a few hours for the rest of the Day. See ya.

Finduilas · 08-17-2011, 09:02 AM

Folwren said she would change the narration to not be from his point of view, so I'm thinking that it will be tolerably obvious to careful readers as to whether he dies. Though I kind of like the idea of the Forgers not knowing.

Nerwen · 08-17-2011, 09:07 AM

So I need to vote soon, just in case my connection goes down again, or I can't otherwise get back online before DL. This will be basically a placeholder, but still for somebody I have some suspicions against– which will probably be G55 (reasons already stated).

The other person I'm considering, though, is McCaber, who has been coming across as quite shifty to me.

Just a moment to think...

EDIT:X'd since last post.

08-17-2011, 05:05 AM	#1
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,461	Ah but Nerwen is not the trick to try and play the same regardless of role? Not that I have ever succeeded really with a special role... tends to bring on melt down. Very frustrating to be so suspected for doing exactly what you normally do..though on that occasion I did happen to be a woluf. Others must be able to perceive a difference whatever I think...like what they say about trying to act drunk - people try to fall over forgetting that a drunk is trying very hard to stay upright...anyway digression... On the subject of Mc Caber is this sort of thing normal? Because it seems odd to me to just jump on other people's work ... I can't obviously object to a G55 vote since I have stated her suspicious but voting after spending what time he had looking at Bom and then seeming to claim the credit for finding G55 suspicious looks fishy to me. Or more accurately wolvish... and I am sorry Phantom I am not going to avoid the term - in this set up we are all dwarves so it is a bit simpler than saying Members of the Valley Forge . I can't help thinking a wolf might jump on TP's plan. As has been pointed wolf on wolf attacks have a different dynamic this game. And to get an early vote in for a fellow wolf might look good too. So hmmm Now I may be being thick but I had assumed the 4 members of the Forge included the KD? IF it doesn't with Glirdan out we certainly can't rest on our laurels. If it does it does leave more scope for there being more than one devil may care wolf. Rikae... don't know... I find her hard to read...but I seem to remember a certain amount of feistyness so ...not TOO worried. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

08-17-2011, 06:20 AM	#3
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,461	Interesting use of tense there Inzil, don't not wouldn't...? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

08-17-2011, 08:33 AM	#8
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,521	Ok, not going to reveal the KD if he dies...hmm, would this mean the other forgers won't know whether their lynched member was the KD or not too? __________________ Fenris Penguin

08-17-2011, 09:02 AM	#11
Finduilas Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Home. Where rolling green hills and clear rivers are practically my backyard. Posts: 595	Folwren said she would change the narration to not be from his point of view, so I'm thinking that it will be tolerably obvious to careful readers as to whether he dies. Though I kind of like the idea of the Forgers not knowing. __________________ One (1) book of rules and traffic regulations, which may not be bent or broken. ~ The Phantom Tollbooth

08-17-2011, 09:07 AM	#12
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	So I need to vote soon, just in case my connection goes down again, or I can't otherwise get back online before DL. This will be basically a placeholder, but still for somebody I have some suspicions against– which will probably be G55 (reasons already stated). The other person I'm considering, though, is McCaber, who has been coming across as quite shifty to me. Just a moment to think... EDIT:X'd since last post. __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.