Why was the army of the dead at Minas Tirith?

[Beregond]

Indeed. Their presence at Minas Tirith absolutely killed all sense of sacrifice, glory, courage, despair, hope, and anything else that made the Battle of the Pelennor one of the most riveting, inspiring chapters in the Return of the King. All of the suspense: completely wiped out. The entire battle before the ships arrived: made moot by the arrival of the the Dead, who erased the enemy almost as efficiently as they erased the credibility of the scene. I can hardly stand to watch that part.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Beregond

Indeed. Their presence at Minas Tirith absolutely killed all sense of sacrifice, glory, courage, despair, hope, and anything else that made the Battle of the Pellenor one of the most riveting, inspiring chapters in the Return of the King. All of the suspense: completely wiped out. The entire battle before the ships arrived: made moot by the arrival of the the Dead, who erased the enemy almost as efficiently as they erased the credibility of the scene. I can hardly stand to watch that part.

Oh, yes, right you are. I forgot that it ruined the suspense as well: that's another key point. I mean, couldn't they at least have been a little less effective? And I don't think it looks in any way fine or spirits-lifting when the army sweeps to the city - it's more like "oh goodness, now those cold dead men kill all the poor people within".

[Beregond]

Quite. Anti-climactic is the word.

the victory in Pelennor Fields was the great victory of Men. In the movies, it's the great victory of Flubber.

Very well put! I missed that point. But you're entirely right. It fits in with the movie maker's obsession with Men being weak and useless.

I don't buy your first excuse for the filmmaker's. They didn't really have to show the battles in...those places in S. Gondor. They could have made a big scene with the taking of the Corsair ships, bid goodbye and thank you very much to Flubber, briefly show citizens of S. Gondor boarding those ships, and have the rest of the Battle take place around Minas Tirith.

And there's no way that non-Tolkien fans appreciated the Flubberization of the Pelennor any more than we do....is there?

[Tuor in Gondolin]

It's hard to say which was worse, the green slime at the Battle of
Minas Tirith or Gandalf assaulting the Stewart of Gondor in
direct contravention to his instructions. Actually, I suppose the
green slime, especially since in the movie there is no reason Aragorn
then lets them go, not even letting them get in a little dwarf
tossing. All it would have taken was a brief scene of Aragorn letting the green
slime go (even quoting the book), and rallying the Gondorians.
Btw, PJ and friends missed one of the great scenes in the book of
Eomer seeing the black ships Arwen banner and tossing up his sword
and the bells of Gondor ringing. (An echo of Churchill's having the
bells in British churches ringing [after Alamein?] )?

[Lush]

The special effects were bad. It was Flubber... or else something that was left over on the cutting room floor of "The Frighteners."

But then again, the movie was already so unwieldy. I can see how the plot decision was made, easily enough.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

It was not only the Armies of men aboard the ships that I missed, I really love it when the re-inforcments arrive at Minas Tirith before the siege. The description of the different companies and especially to hear of the hopes and disapointment of the people.

[Lariren Shadow]

Originally Posted by Beregond

And there's no way that non-Tolkien fans appreciated the Flubberization of the Pelennor any more than we do....is there?

Some of them did. I happened to be sitting next to them when I saw it in theatres and they thought it was "awesome".

I do wish they had made it more of a victory of men rather than of dead men. I always liked Return of the King the best and, while I did enjoy the movie when I first saw it(purely as a movie, I kind of always thought of them as two different entities) I thought it looked amazing at times. There were other times when I cringed away from what was happening on screen(really dead guys all over Minas Tirith, really?!)

I can also see where PJ might have thought "ok look at all these new places...look at the average movie go-er...dead guys win at Pelennor."

In the EE they at least have the taking of the ships in. Though its just not the same.

[Morthoron]

The scrubbing bubbles were absolutely necessary to clean the white walls of Minas Tirith. The stonework was absolutely filthy!

[Lush]

Personally, even if I could divorce myself from being a Tolkien fan - the special effects were not good.

Helm's Deep on the other hand.... Well, it's still one of my favourite battle scenes ever. In spite of the changes. But it looks more organic. That's the thing.

[Beregond]

That's right - the Battle of Helm's Deep was more real and down to earth (organic, I like that). Man vs. Orc (plus Gimli and Legolas). Even the Elves who were spirited into the movie didn't upset the balance too badly. It was a fight to the death free of supernatural influence; yes, the Huorns came, but it was the Men as sent the Orcs into the Huorn Wood.

Sure, there was some silliness and over-the-top special effects, but most importantly the climax was retained: the Horn of Helm Hammerhand sounding in the Deep, and the riding out of the Rohirrim.

I'd bet if Gallup Research polled 1000 average movie goers they would find more people preferred the ending of The Two Towers over the conclusion to the Battle of the Pelennor.