The curse of Morgoth in CoH.

[Raynor]

Originally Posted by skip

We can speculate whether Eru already knew Melkor was going to rebel (which indirectly would be an argument against free will) or if he didn't. I suggest we drop this point as you can find plenty of support for both options in the texts.

Though I would gladly debate over whether pure psychological knowledge is at odds with free will, I guess we will have to bag this.

But all the rational beings under Eru were created with this free will to choose between the good and the bad, so that they would do good IMO. Melkor, the mightiest under Eru, failed this hope.
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Melkor didn't create evil per se, that I can go along with. But he is still the mythologiocal equivilance of evil. What he did do was to corrupt the creation with his discord, so that the creatures on earth would be swayed towards doing was is bad, something that would've been against their nature without the marring.

I believe we are in complete agreement over this; I also previously called him the most potent agent of evil.

The question of evil without Melkor is moot.

Oh, I browsed Morgoth's Ring and immideately found a quote to support my view (though I do not doubt you can do the same):

This is from 'the orgin of orcs' writings:

"Orcs can rebell agaist him [Sauron (my addition)] without losing their own irremediable alligiance to evil (Morgoth)."

So there you have it in JRRTs own words: Morgoth is evil.

Hm, those are some very interesting points for me to ponder over these few days, until I have the pleasure to return to our discussion .

[skip spence]

Originally Posted by Raynor

Hm, those are some very interesting points for me to ponder over these few days, until I have the pleasure to return to our discussion .

I look forward to it.