Man to Man in Araman!!!!!

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

I fail to see why, because he obeyed the Valar, Finarfin is a wimp.

[Maédhros]

I fail to see why, because he obeyed the Valar, Finarfin is a wimp.

A person of high moral character would not have needed a warning from the Valar to do the right thing.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Now, to refute you.

Let's analyse the events. Finarfin sees Kinslaying. He could have reacted in two ways.

1. Leave the host to that maniac who just killed his kin. Think what more Fëanor could do in Middle-earth, with himself as king.

Soldier: Our air wing has been lost.
Fëanor: I don't care! Anyone who doesn't attack is a coward!
Soldier (mumbling): Great...

Yes, I know there is no air wing in Arda during that time, but you can substitute anything - a tactician, the archery backup, or a cavalry assault force.

With his depraved state of mind, he could annihilate the entirety of the Noldor! With only Fingolfin to stop him! I don't think he could have lived with that, therefore he did #2...

2. Stay with that maniac in hopes of using your cool, calm, collected mindset to push possibly debilitating actions slightly.

If all else fails, use overwhelming majority to push actions. Fëanor and his sons aren't scared of just a majority. Their handful ravaged the Havens of Sirion. So you'll need to overwhelm them, in case something goes...wrong.

Cute understatement.

Then, the Doom of Mandos. Great. Now, his only reason to go on is zapped. No matter what he and his brother can do, tell, or sing to Fëanor, all will go wrong. Why waste all your people in a hopeless quest?

He went back. Not a wimpy decision.

[Maédhros]

1. Leave the host to that maniac who just killed his kin. Think what more Fëanor could do in Middle-earth, with himself as king.

Remember that, although Fëanor had claimed the kingship of the Ñoldor, the majority of them still held Fingolfin as their king and if you read the Shibboleth of Fëanor

Fingolfin had prefixed the name Finwë to Ñolofinwë before the Exiles reached Middle-earth. This was in pursuance of his claim to be the chieftain of all the Ñoldor after the death of Finwë, and so enraged Fëanor that it was no doubt one of the reasons for his treachery in abandoning Fingolfin and stealing away with all the ships.

If both of the hosts of the Ñoldor had reached ME at the same time, the majority of them would have taken Fingolfin as their king.

Stay with that maniac in hopes of using your cool, calm, collected mindset to push possibly debilitating actions slightly.

That was actually the mindset of Fingon urging his father to follow the host. The thing is that Fingolfin had to follow Fëanor, for he had given his word to him before.

Then, the Doom of Mandos. Great. Now, his only reason to go on is zapped. No matter what he and his brother can do, tell, or sing to Fëanor, all will go wrong. Why waste all your people in a hopeless quest?

This doesn't adds up. Finarfin knew before that that it was a hopeless quest.
From the Published Silmarillion

But even as the trumpet sang and Fëanor issued from the gates of Tirion a messenger came at last from Manwë, saying: 'Against the folly of Fëanor shall be set my counsel only. Go not forth! For the hour is evil, and your road leads to sorrow that ye do not foresee. No aid will the Valar lend you in this quest; but neither will they hinder you; for this ye shall know: as ye came hither freely, freely shall ye depart. But thou Fëanor Finwë's son, by thine oath art exiled. The lies of Melkor thou shalt unlearn in bitterness. Vala he is, thou saist Then thou hast sworn in vain, for none of the Valar canst thou overcome now or ever within the halls of Eä, not though Eru whom thou namest had made thee thrice greater than thou art.'

At that time, before the Doom of Mandos, the Ñoldor knew that no matter what they did, they could not overcome Morgoth. I want to make a clarification. I did not say that going back was a wimpy decision on the part of Finarfin, I said that it was wimpy of him to go back after the Doom of Mandos was uttered. Lets see the facts:

1. Finarfin knew that the quest of the Ñoldor to beat Morgoth was hopeless.
2. He knew that before the kinslaying, to follow Fëanor was not a good thing.
3. He knew that the Kinslaying at Alqualondë was a horrible act.
4. Finarfin had passed from Alqualondë to the Wastes of Araman following Fëanor.

Now the questions that I make is simple. If Finarfin had this knowledge in advance, why couldn't he make the right decision by himself that he should have turned back inmediately after the Kinslaying of Alqualondë?
To me, he had not the inner strenght to go back by himself, he needed the waring of the Valar to do that.
What if the Doom of the Valar had been uttered after the Ñoldor had reached ME? Too late Finarfin.

[doug*platypus]

For any else that is interested, here is a link to the thread that Maédhros asked for on the possible role of Finrod at the Kinslaying. That discussion and this one, of course, have much in common.

Finrod and the Kinslaying

Although I still applaud Finarfin for his decision to turn back (which I believe was heroic in a "cut your losses and save your bacon" kind of way), I think Maédhros has raised a valid point about his motivation. If we assume that Finarfin knew about the events at Alqualondë shortly after they occurred, then the main thing that made him turn back was the Doom of Mandos.

So, was he simply swayed by fear? I don't believe so. Fëanor could have been just as scary as Mandos... well, nearly. I prefer to think that the warning of Manwë and the wrath of the Valar showed Finarfin the error of his people's ways. And also I suppose, most of his followers would have been keen to go home after Mandos had spoken to them. The part Finarfin had to play as leader of his host may have been small; it could have been more of a mob rule kind of decision.

But at any rate, Finarfin stood out from his brothers by not allowing pride to rule him. He reaped the rewards, too. I think you could probably say that he had a happier life than Fingolfin, despite the lost chances for glory, and the fact that he is called a wimp!

[Maédhros]

A little chronology of the Events: (All of the timelines are from Annals of Aman)

Year of the Trees
1495
Morgoth destroys the Two Trees
1st Kinslaying at Alqalondë

1496
Doom and Prophecy of Mandos

A Year of the Trees had already passed between the two events. And in order to reach the Wastes of Araman, one needed to go through Alqualondë and then north to Araman. Finarfin definitely had already knowledge of the Kinslaying. The other alternative was that he was an idiot and I don't believe that he was.

It is sad but if you look in detail at what happened, the thing that made Finarfin turn back was the Doom of Mandos. A person of high moral character wouldn't have needed a warning such as that to go back, he would have done it himself because it was the right thing to do.

[symestreem]

Is it possible that Finarfin did not know the true facts of the Kinslaying? It says of the battle,

Thrice the people of Feanor were driven back, and many were slain upon either side; but the vanguard of the Noldor was succoured by Fingon, with the foremost of the host of Fingolfin, who coming up found a battle joined and their own kin falling, and rushed in before they knew rightly the cause of the quarrel; some thought indeed that the Teleri had sought to waylay the march of the Noldor and the bidding of the Valar.