Gnomes - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

burrahobbit · 09-16-2002, 02:18 PM

As we all know, the Noldor started out in the mythos as Gnomes. Eventually, I suppose, Tolkien begain to dislike the connotations of this word, so he changed it to Noldor. But even so, he seems to have written in a story to keep the word Gnome alive.

Quote:

Thus it was that Men called King Felagund, whom they first met of all the Eldar, Nóm, that is Wisdom, in the language of that people, and after they named his folk Nómin, the Wise.

burrahobbit · 09-16-2002, 02:37 PM

They do! Check out the etymology here!

[ September 16, 2002: Message edited by: burrahobbit ]

***Sharkû*** · 09-16-2002, 02:39 PM

Commentary on The Cottage of Lost Play, BoLT1:

“I conclude this commentary with a note on my father's use of the word Gnomes for the Noldor, who in the Lost Tales are called Noldoli. He continued to use it for many years,
and it still appeared in earlier editions of The Hobbit.* In a draft for the final paragraph of Appendix F to The Lord of the Rings he wrote:
I have sometimes (not in this book) used 'Gnomes' for Noldor and 'Gnomish' for Noldorin. This I did, for whatever Paracelsus may have thought (if indeed he invented the name) to
some 'Gnome' will still suggest knowledge.Now the High-elven name of this people, Noldor, signifies Those who Know; for of the three kindreds of the Eldar from their beginning the
Noldor were ever distinguished both by their knowledge of things that are and were in this world, and by their desire to know more. Yet they in no way resembled the Gnomes either
of learned theory or popular fancy; and I have now abandoned this rendering as too misleading. For the Noldor belonged to a race high and beautiful, the elder Children of the world, who now are gone. Tall they were, fair-skinned and grey-eyed, and their locks were dark, save in the golden house of Finrod...
In the last paragraph of Appendix F as published the reference to 'Gnomes' was removed, and replaced by a passage explaining the use of the word Elves to translateQuendi and Eldar despite the diminishing of the English word.

* In Chapter 3, A Short Rest, 'swords of the High Elves of the West' replaced 'swords of the elves that are now called Gnomes', and in Chapter 8, Flies and Spiders, the phrase 'There the Light-elves and the Deep-elves and the Sea-elves went and lived for ages' replaced 'There
the Light-elves and the Deep-elves (or Gnomes) and the Sea-elves lived for ages'.
Two words are in question: (1) Greek gnome 'thought, intelligence' (and in the plural 'maxims, sayings', whence the English word gnome, a maxim or aphorism, and adjective gnomic); and (2) the word gnome used by the 16th-century writer Paracelsus as a synonym of pygmaeus.
Paracelsus 'says that the beings so called have the earth as their element... through which they move unobstructed as fish do through water, or birds and land animals through air' (Oxford English Dictionary s.v. Gnome'). The O.E.D. suggests that whether Paracelsus invented the
word himself or not it was intended to mean 'earth-dweller', and discounts any connection with the other word Gnome. (This note is repeated from that in The Letters of J. R. R. Tolkien, p. 449; see the letter(no. 239) to which it refers.)”

Commentary on the Quenta Noldorinwa, HoME 4:

“It is interesting to observe that after my father abandoned the use of the word 'Gnome' (see I. 43 - 4) he
retained Nom as the word for 'wisdom' in the language of the people of Beor (The Silmarillion p. 141).”

From the Quenta Silmarillion, HoME 5:

“Thus it was that Men called King Felagund, whom thev met first of all the Noldor, Gnome or Wisdom;* and after him they named his race the Wise, whom we call the Gnomes.

(* Footnote to the text: It is recorded that the word in the ancient speech of these Men, which they afterwards forsook in Beleriand for the tongue of the Gnomes, so that it is now mostly forgotten, was Widris. Against this is written in the margin: quoth Pengolod. Added to this: & AElfwine.) “

The last, and latest, footnote makes it obvious that nóm is just a translation of the true Bëorian widris, probably made to appear like a predecessor of the Greek word mentioned above.

09-16-2002, 02:37 PM	#2
burrahobbit Hidden Spirit Join Date: May 2000 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,424	They do! Check out the etymology here! [ September 16, 2002: Message edited by: burrahobbit ] __________________ What's a burrahobbit got to do with my pocket, anyways?

09-16-2002, 02:39 PM	#3
*Sharkû* Hungry Ghoul Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 1,719	Commentary on The Cottage of Lost Play, BoLT1: “I conclude this commentary with a note on my father's use of the word Gnomes for the Noldor, who in the Lost Tales are called Noldoli. He continued to use it for many years, and it still appeared in earlier editions of The Hobbit.* In a draft for the final paragraph of Appendix F to The Lord of the Rings he wrote: I have sometimes (not in this book) used 'Gnomes' for Noldor and 'Gnomish' for Noldorin. This I did, for whatever Paracelsus may have thought (if indeed he invented the name) to some 'Gnome' will still suggest knowledge.Now the High-elven name of this people, Noldor, signifies Those who Know; for of the three kindreds of the Eldar from their beginning the Noldor were ever distinguished both by their knowledge of things that are and were in this world, and by their desire to know more. Yet they in no way resembled the Gnomes either of learned theory or popular fancy; and I have now abandoned this rendering as too misleading. For the Noldor belonged to a race high and beautiful, the elder Children of the world, who now are gone. Tall they were, fair-skinned and grey-eyed, and their locks were dark, save in the golden house of Finrod... In the last paragraph of Appendix F as published the reference to 'Gnomes' was removed, and replaced by a passage explaining the use of the word Elves to translateQuendi and Eldar despite the diminishing of the English word. * In Chapter 3, A Short Rest, 'swords of the High Elves of the West' replaced 'swords of the elves that are now called Gnomes', and in Chapter 8, Flies and Spiders, the phrase 'There the Light-elves and the Deep-elves and the Sea-elves went and lived for ages' replaced 'There the Light-elves and the Deep-elves (or Gnomes) and the Sea-elves lived for ages'. Two words are in question: (1) Greek gnome 'thought, intelligence' (and in the plural 'maxims, sayings', whence the English word gnome, a maxim or aphorism, and adjective gnomic); and (2) the word gnome used by the 16th-century writer Paracelsus as a synonym of pygmaeus. Paracelsus 'says that the beings so called have the earth as their element... through which they move unobstructed as fish do through water, or birds and land animals through air' (Oxford English Dictionary s.v. Gnome'). The O.E.D. suggests that whether Paracelsus invented the word himself or not it was intended to mean 'earth-dweller', and discounts any connection with the other word Gnome. (This note is repeated from that in The Letters of J. R. R. Tolkien, p. 449; see the letter(no. 239) to which it refers.)” Commentary on the Quenta Noldorinwa, HoME 4: “It is interesting to observe that after my father abandoned the use of the word 'Gnome' (see I. 43 - 4) he retained Nom as the word for 'wisdom' in the language of the people of Beor (The Silmarillion p. 141).” From the Quenta Silmarillion, HoME 5: “Thus it was that Men called King Felagund, whom thev met first of all the Noldor, Gnome or Wisdom;* and after him they named his race the Wise, whom we call the Gnomes. (* Footnote to the text: It is recorded that the word in the ancient speech of these Men, which they afterwards forsook in Beleriand for the tongue of the Gnomes, so that it is now mostly forgotten, was Widris. Against this is written in the margin: quoth Pengolod. Added to this: & AElfwine.) “ The last, and latest, footnote makes it obvious that nóm is just a translation of the true Bëorian widris, probably made to appear like a predecessor of the Greek word mentioned above.