What do you think happened to Frodo after Gray Havens..........

[Child of the 7th Age]

Child - I can see Frodo basically doing those things, but he seems to retain his basic "hobbit-ness" in your theories, and I can't really see that as being the case.

Bird,

You raise some very interesting points. I think my answer is that I'm just not sure in some areas.

I do think that, after Bilbo's passing, Frodo would have changed in some of the ways you indicate. Yes, he would have become more knowledgable about lore and song and history. Perhaps, he would have become a bit more scholarly, although Bilbo actually had more natural leanings in that direction than Frodo. It was Bilbo, for example, who was the translator of the Silm, and who wrote poetry with Aragorn.

I actually see Frodo as less of a scholar and more as a mystic or seer. It was he, rather than Bilbo, who had dreams and visions. He is the one with the light in his eyes and his face. And when Gandalf wonders in Rivendell what is to become of Frodo, he seems to compare him implicitly to something very akin to the phial of Galadriel (which itself contains a sliver of a silmaril):

He may become like a glass filled with a clear light for eyes to see that can.

But the real question I have is when you suggest that Frodo may lose his hobbit-ness, and indeed would need to "rise to the level" of the Elves. This I do not agree with. All through Tolkien's writings we are given a strong indication that the worst thing any creature can do is to belittle the gifts that come to their own people and try to emulate those of another.

I am thinking of the Men of Numenor who became so jealous of immortality and Valinor and the Elves that they destroyed the beautiful culture which they had. I am thinking of Morgoth who could not accept his limitations as a Vala but strove to become like Eru. I am thinking of those Elves who resisted the Valar's call to come to Amon, and instead chose to remain in Middle-earth at a time when Men were becoming the dominent group. All of those examples have some sadness attached, although of differing degrees and levels.

In all those cases, beings were trying to be or become something that Eru or the Valar did not intend for them. To put it succinctly, I think Eru made Frodo a hobbit, and a hobbit he would have to stay. He admittedly would evolve into a different hobbit than the one who lived in Middle-earth. There is a fine line between a hobbit chasing after Elves, and a hobbit becoming an Elf. The former is elevating; the latter would be a disaster.

By the time Sam arrived on the Lonely Isle, I wonder if the Frodo he met there would even bear any resemblance to the Frodo that left 60 years before.

Again, I wouldn't go this far. That hobbit-ness which is at the core of Frodo has to remain there. Otherwise, he becomes something else, and this something else goes against his very nature and fea.

If he hadn't done this (i.e. lost his hobbit-ness), I could see his life Tol Eressëa becoming more of a burden then a pleasure, and Frodo becoming a figure of pity, rather than admiration.

No, I don't think so.I think the Elves and Maia could relate to such a Frodo. They were able to do so on the Ring quest, and I do not think that would change. Yes, Frodo would learn more intellectually and spiritually than he ever had before, but he would still be Frodo the Hobbit.

sharon, the 7th age hobbit