New Tolkien book coming! - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Galin · 08-04-2021, 12:59 PM

A preview if the link works.

https://preview.aer.io/The_Nature_of...l=1&emailcap=0

Huinesoron · 08-05-2021, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galin

A preview if the link works.

https://preview.aer.io/The_Nature_of...l=1&emailcap=0

So what is that site? Because it doesn't seem to be connected to Harper Collins, and the preview is... pretty extensive. Which is cool, but... there's a month still before the book comes out, why can I read dozens of pages?

... also, why in those dozens of pages am I finding that Tolkien thought it was a good idea to keep Elvish women pregnant for nine Years of the Sun? That's just O.O.

hS

Galin · 08-05-2021, 06:13 AM

Hmm. I didn't really take the time to notice. Someone posted it elsewhere and I posted it here.

I hope it's legal. I too was a bit surprised at the number of pages.

Galin · 08-05-2021, 12:10 PM

Contents:

https://books.google.fr/books?id=MDQ...page&q&f=false

Galadriel and Celeborn!

Huinesoron · 08-05-2021, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galin

Contents:

https://books.google.fr/books?id=MDQ...page&q&f=false

Galadriel and Celeborn!

Weirdly, it initially showed me the full contents list, but has now trimmed it down to the first page... ANYWAY, the most intriguing looking ones were things like "Descriptions of Characters", "Dwellings in Middle-earth", and "Note on the Consumption of Mushrooms" (

). Also "Note on Dwarvish Voices", which, I can't even imagine what would be in that.

The early sections seem to have a /lot/ of stuff on how he imagined the early reproduction rates of the elves, so I guess we'll conclusively be able to answer "were Finwe et al Unborn Quendi?"

(I can't remember what they were, but there were so many chapters which seemed to imply an answer to one of the Frequent Debates that I was surprised not to see "The nature of Bombadil and a precise physical description of balrogs" in there...)

hS

Huinesoron · 08-06-2021, 02:09 AM

I've uploaded an image of the contents list, in case Google Books mucks anyone else around. Some more intriguing ones:

-Parts of the 'Generational Schemes' are visible in the various previews, and include lists of precisely when the later generations of Quendi were born. I also saw a note that the first generation ("Seniors") refused to go on the Great March, which is fascinating. Looking forward to burrowing into the details.

-'Elvish Life-Cycles' might include some stuff about the mysterious second and third stages in which elves grow beards.

-'Beauty and Goodness' has the potential to be either really enlightening or really uncomfortable. Given the existence of Sauron, and of "looks foul but feels fair", I hope for the former.

-'Gender and Sex' is interesting, because even if it's Hostetter's wording, it implies a separation on Tolkien's part. Best guess is that he's talking about gender roles - ie, more on 'women make lembas and tend to do healing'.

-'Descriptions of characters' is seven pages long! Could it be a note to an illustrator, like the notes for the Baynes map? Will Tolkien actually describe any characters, or just go on about how they 'feel'?

-'Mind-pictures'? Colour me intrigued.

-'The visible forms of the Valar and Maiar' could be a second descriptive piece, or could be philosophical musings on what their substance was.

-'Note on Elvish Economy': clearly all those early Gnomish words like 'lawyer' and 'slave' are about to become very important!

-'Dwellings in Middle-earth' could be locations, or types of houses.

-'The Founding of Nargothrond' I love because Nargothrond.

-'Of the Land and Beasts of Numenor' is 11 pages long! A substantial description.

-'Note on the Consumption of Mushrooms' is undoubtedly the most important piece in the entire book.

-'Galadriel and Celeborn' is ten pages which will undoubtedly just confuse things the more. I'm betting Galadriel is now Finwe's daughter who sailed to Middle-earth and back before the Noldolante, and Celeborn is a Silvan elf from over the mountains who crossed them by himself to meet her because Fate.

-'Note on Dwarvish Voices' is only a page long, but, like... what could it say? It's be hilarious if it was just "Memo: the dwarves DO NOT sound like Disney's."

And I'm sure there'll be more once we actually get the book... only a month to go!

hS

mhagain · 08-06-2021, 08:02 AM

I'm hugely stoked for this.

Two intriguing tidbits from the preview are indications that it was Sauron, not Melkor, at the original Fall of Men, and that Ingwe, Finwe and Elwe were not first generation Elves, both of which have been long-standing personal deductions of mine, but until now with nothing explicit in any writing of Tolkien to back them up.

Galin · 08-06-2021, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

'Descriptions of characters' is seven pages long! Could it be a note to an illustrator, like the notes for the Baynes map? Will Tolkien actually describe any characters, or just go on about how they 'feel'?

My guess here is that it's JRRT's reaction to the characters from this map. We've had some bits already, but again,
just a guess of course.

Quote:

'Galadriel and Celeborn' is ten pages which will undoubtedly just confuse things the more. I'm betting Galadriel is now Finwe's daughter who sailed to Middle-earth and back before the Noldolante, and Celeborn is a Silvan elf from over the mountains who crossed them by himself to meet her because Fate.

Yikes. In my excitement I didn't notice it was ten pages.

Maybe the font is huge

08-04-2021, 12:59 PM	#1
Galin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,036	A preview if the link works. https://preview.aer.io/The_Nature_of...l=1&emailcap=0 Last edited by Galin; 08-04-2021 at 01:03 PM.

08-06-2021, 02:09 AM	#6
Huinesoron Overshadowed Eagle Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea Posts: 3,957	I've uploaded an image of the contents list, in case Google Books mucks anyone else around. Some more intriguing ones: -Parts of the 'Generational Schemes' are visible in the various previews, and include lists of precisely when the later generations of Quendi were born. I also saw a note that the first generation ("Seniors") refused to go on the Great March, which is fascinating. Looking forward to burrowing into the details. -'Elvish Life-Cycles' might include some stuff about the mysterious second and third stages in which elves grow beards. -'Beauty and Goodness' has the potential to be either really enlightening or really uncomfortable. Given the existence of Sauron, and of "looks foul but feels fair", I hope for the former. -'Gender and Sex' is interesting, because even if it's Hostetter's wording, it implies a separation on Tolkien's part. Best guess is that he's talking about gender roles - ie, more on 'women make lembas and tend to do healing'. -'Descriptions of characters' is seven pages long! Could it be a note to an illustrator, like the notes for the Baynes map? Will Tolkien actually describe any characters, or just go on about how they 'feel'? -'Mind-pictures'? Colour me intrigued. -'The visible forms of the Valar and Maiar' could be a second descriptive piece, or could be philosophical musings on what their substance was. -'Note on Elvish Economy': clearly all those early Gnomish words like 'lawyer' and 'slave' are about to become very important! -'Dwellings in Middle-earth' could be locations, or types of houses. -'The Founding of Nargothrond' I love because Nargothrond. -'Of the Land and Beasts of Numenor' is 11 pages long! A substantial description. -'Note on the Consumption of Mushrooms' is undoubtedly the most important piece in the entire book. -'Galadriel and Celeborn' is ten pages which will undoubtedly just confuse things the more. I'm betting Galadriel is now Finwe's daughter who sailed to Middle-earth and back before the Noldolante, and Celeborn is a Silvan elf from over the mountains who crossed them by himself to meet her because Fate. -'Note on Dwarvish Voices' is only a page long, but, like... what could it say? It's be hilarious if it was just "Memo: the dwarves DO NOT sound like Disney's." And I'm sure there'll be more once we actually get the book... only a month to go! hS __________________ Have you burned the ships that could bear you back again? ~Finrod: The Rock Opera

08-06-2021, 08:02 AM	#7
mhagain Wight Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: The best seat in the Golden Perch Posts: 219	I'm hugely stoked for this. Two intriguing tidbits from the preview are indications that it was Sauron, not Melkor, at the original Fall of Men, and that Ingwe, Finwe and Elwe were not first generation Elves, both of which have been long-standing personal deductions of mine, but until now with nothing explicit in any writing of Tolkien to back them up. __________________ Then one appeared among us, in our own form visible, but greater and more beautiful; and he said that he had come out of pity.

08-05-2021, 06:13 AM	#3
Galin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,036	Hmm. I didn't really take the time to notice. Someone posted it elsewhere and I posted it here. I hope it's legal. I too was a bit surprised at the number of pages.

08-05-2021, 12:10 PM	#4
Galin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,036	Contents: https://books.google.fr/books?id=MDQ...page&q&f=false Galadriel and Celeborn!