Please Help me Understand Gondor Stewardship and Kingship

[Galadriel55]

I feel that Cirion's choice to give away Calenardhon is only immoral if you consider Gondor's ancient borders as something sacred or set in stone, something that cannot be changed. But what's in a border? What use are the old borders to a country that's shrunken to a third - if not less - of its size? Gondor already gave up most of its land, in fact if not in law. They old borders mean something in their tradition - Boromir's horn is supposed to be heard anywhere inside the old boundaries, and Faramir gives Frodo leave to pass on old Gondorian lands that really aren't in their control anymore. But the reality is that Gondor lives on a fraction of its former land, and land without inhabitants cannot be claimed by said inhabitants. The old boundaries mean something in tradition, but they are a relic that did not reflect the newer times - and will not reflect Aragorn's times either since it seems like his realm would be much wider and possibly eventually include all lands west of Rhun. So is there anything inherently unchangeable about Gondor's borders?

If the issue in question is not in the borders themselves but in Cirion - that it was not within his rights to give away land that was not his - I would argue against that for two reasons. First, the Stewards are not supposed to preserve Gondor in a cocoon and prevent any change, to keep it exactly as it was in the days of the king. They are supposed to rule Gondor as a king would rule it, and to rule it in its best interests. Best interests don't always include territorial expansion. Secondly, I see the gift not as giving away land, but as gaining an ally. Gondor could not populate Calenardhon. The land is or will soon be lost anyways. But the oath Cirion and Eorl gave makes Rohan an eternal friend to Gondor. So yes, the land is given to a new set of inhabitants, but if you think about is in terms of political alignment rather than race Cirion actually made Gondor stronger. Where it used to have the power of one nation, it now has two, and someone to cover their back. The land is still serving Gondor's prosperity even under the complete control of the Rohirrim by nature of their oath. It's not really a gift, and it's not a lease, but it's something in between that hangs on the good faith of the rulers of both countries.

[Morthoron]

Cirion's decision was realpolitik. He granted Calenardhon to Eorl because he could not hold it. Better to gain fealty from an ally than have the land overrun by Easterlings. Cirion's decision proved farsighted. It's certainly not something a Denethor II would have done.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Morthoron

Cirion's decision was realpolitik. He granted Calenardhon to Eorl because he could not hold it. Better to gain fealty from an ally than have the land overrun by Easterlings. Cirion's decision proved farsighted. It's certainly not something a Denethor II would have done.

Well, Cirion and Eorl does acknowledge that Cirion didn't make the offer solely from the goodness, of his heart; he did, though, genuinely have an affection for Eorl and his people, and wanted to give them some great reward.

I think Denethor might have done the same, though the potential benefit to Gondor would have been the driving factor.

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Pelendur started this by rejecting Arvedui's claim to the throne for the far weaker one of General Earnil

Far weaker? Not at all. Earnil was a direct descendant of Anarion, which Arvedui wasn't. Note that while Arvedui's son theoretically might have claimed distaff descent via his mother, Arvedui could hardly do so in right of his wife. Besides, as far as mighty Gondor was concerned, Arvedui was already "last of a ragged house long bereft of lordship and dignity." It was probably seen as nearly as risible as some Holy Roman Emperor claiming the Byzantine throne.

When Earnil's son Earnur died without issue, matters had changed because apparently "descendants of Anarion" was now a null set. But by this time Arvedui was dead and Arnor no more.