3 Concerning Naugrim, Ents and Eagles

[Findegil]

DE-EX-10 and DE-EX-11: I had some doubts about the naming of Durin here, but I am open to retake the mentionings of Durin. I would only remove the last:

... but of the preservation of the body of a former King {Durin (say) }to which at intervals his spirit would return. ...

Here I think we should be more general.

DE-EX-11: gramatical issue: Agreed.

The Legolas/Pengolod issue: Our text is an amalgament of diffrent texts, so I wouldn't say it is a problem.

Respecfully
Findegil

[ArcusCalion]

awesome, looks good!

[Findegil]

I have forgotten to add one important bit from Of Dwarves and Men:

<Concerning the Dwarves; passage (e) Then Aulë took the Seven Dwarves and laid them to rest under stone in far-sundered places, and beside each he laid his mate, save only beside the Eldest, and he lay alone. And Aule returned to Valinor and waited long as best he might. But it is not known when Durin or his brethren first awoke, though some think that it was at the time of the departure of the Eldar over sea.>
DE-EX-07.2<Of Dwarves and Men, HoME 12 In the Dwarvish traditions of the Third Age the names of the places where each of the Seven Ancestors had 'awakened' were remembered; but only two of them were known to Elves and Men of the West: the most westerly, the awakening place of the ancestors of the Firebeards and the Broadbeams; and that of the ancestor of the Longbeards,[Footnote to the text: He alone had no companions. DE-EX-07.3{; cf. 'he slept alone' (III.352). [The reference is to the beginning of Appendix A, III. The passage in the text is difficult to interpret. My father refers here to four places of awakening of the Seven Ancestors of the Dwarves: those of 'the ancestors of the Firebeards and the Broadbeams', 'the ancestor of the Longbeards', 'the Ironfists and Stiffbeards', and 'the Blacklocks and Stonefoots'. (None of these names of the other six kindreds of the Dwarves has ever been given before. Since the ancestors of the Firebeards and the Broadbeams awoke in the Ered Lindon, these kindreds must be presumed to be the Dwarves of Nogrod and Belegost.) It seems that he was here referring to Durin's having 'slept alone' in contrast to the other kindreds, whose Fathers were laid to sleep in pairs. If this is so, it is a different conception from that cited in XI.213, where Iluvatar 'commanded Aule to lay the fathers of the Dwarves severally in deep places, each with his mate, save Durin the eldest who had none.' On the subject of the 'mates' of the Fathers of the Dwarves see XI.211-13. - In the margin of the typescript my father wrote later (against the present note): '}He wandered widely after awakening: his people were Dwarves that joined him from other kindreds west and east.{'; and at the head of the page he suggested that the legend of the Making of the Dwarves should be altered (indeed very radically altered) to a form in which other Dwarves were laid to sleep near to the Fathers.]}] the eldest in making and awakening. The first had been in the north of the Ered Lindon, the great eastern wall of Beleriand, of which the Blue Mountains of the Second and later ages were the remnant; the second had been Mount Gundabad (in origin a Khuzdul name), which was therefore revered by the Dwarves, DE-EX-07.4{and its occupation in the Third Age by the Orks of Sauron was one of the chief reasons for their great hatred of the Orks.[Footnote to the text: [In the rejected conclusion of note 21 the place of the awakening of the ancestor of the Longbeards was 'a valley in the Ered Mithrin' (the Grey Mountains in the far North). There has of course been no previous reference to this ancient significance of Mount Gundabad. That mountain originally appeared in the chapter The Clouds Burst in The Hobbit, where it is told that the Goblins 'marched and gathered by hill and valley, going ever by tunnel or under dark, until around and beneath the great mountain Gundabad of the North, where was their capital, a vast host was assembled'; and it is shown on the map of Wilderland in The Hobbit as a great isolated mass at the northern end of the Misty Mountains where the Grey Mountains drew towards them. In The Lord of the Rings, Appendix A (III), Gundabad appears in the account of the War of the Dwarves and Orcs late in the Third Age, where the Dwarves 'assailed and sacked one by one all the strongholds of the Orcs that they could [find] from Gundabad to the Gladden' (the word 'find' was erroneously dropped in the Second Edition).]]} The other two places were eastward, at distances as great or greater than that between the Blue Mountains and Gundabad: the arising of the Ironfists and Stiffbeards, and that of the Blacklocks and Stonefoots. Though these four points were far sundered the Dwarves of different kindreds were in communication, and in the early ages often held assemblies of delegates at Mount Gundabad. In times of great need even the most distant would send help to any of their peopleDE-EX-07.5{; as was the case in the great War against the Orks (Third Age 2793 to 2799)}. Though they were loth to migrate and make permanent dwellings or 'mansions' far from their original homes, except under great pressure from enemies or after some catastropheDE-EX-07.6{ such as the ruin of Beleriand}, they were great and hardy travellers and skilled road-makers; also, all the kindreds shared a common language.[Footnote to the text: According to their legends their begetter, Aule the Vala, had made this for them and had taught it to the Seven Fathers before they were laid to sleep until the time for their awakening should come. After their awakening this language (as all languages and all other things in Arda) changed in time, and divergently in the mansions that were far-sundered. But the change was so slow and the divergence so small that even in the Third Age converse between all Dwarves in their own tongue was easy. As they said, the change in Khuzdul as compared with the tongue of the Elves, and still more with those of Men, was 'like the weathering of hard rock compared with the melting of snow.']>
Since they were to come in the days of the power of Melkor, Aulë made the Dwarves strong to endure. Therefore they are stone-hard, stubborn, fast in friendship and in enmity, and they suffer toil and hunger and hurt of body more hardily than all other speaking peoples; and they live long, far beyond the span of Men, yet not for ever. DE-EX-08<HoME 11; substitution to QS $5. The Naugrim were ever, as they still remain, ...

Porbably we also should do something with the informtion from the footnote that 'other Dwarves were laid to sleep near to the Fathers'. But I hesitate about that in the moment.

Respectfully
Findegil

[ArcusCalion]

I would hesitate to chop up Of Dwarves and Men, as I have said before. I feel that by removing all the references to the Third Age, we are gutting an essentially complete work for no reason, especially when we can easily include it in its entirety in Volume II.

[Findegil]

I don't think that Of Dwarves and Men is useable complete in volume 2. If at all the essay would fit in volume 3. Of Dwarves and Men is in over all a linguistic essay. But its story content ranges from the awakening of Dwarves to the end of the Third Age.
But I anyhow think that the content is needed in many parts. Pushed in part 3 it is fully out of sequence. I agree that the forward references that are included are valuable. But the question have we to remove them all? In The Silmarillion we as well such forward references. Not over much but a few are there.

Respectfully
Findegil

[Findegil]

Okay at long last I have made up my mind about the footnote concerning the additional dwarves add by Ilúvatar. I think they are needed. Therefore I propose the following:

DE-EX-07{Then Aulë took the Seven Fathers of the Dwarves, and laid them to rest in far-sundered places; and he returned to Valinor, and waited while the long years lengthened.} <Concerning the Dwarves; passage (e) Then Aulë took the Seven Dwarves and laid them to rest under stone in far-sundered places, and beside each he laid his mate, save only beside the Eldest, and he lay alone.DE-EX-07.1 <Of Dwarves and Men, HoME 12, Note 24 {and at the head of the page he suggested that the legend of the Making of the Dwarves should be altered (indeed very radically altered) to a form in which <Concerning the Dwarves; passage (a) But it is said that to each Dwarf Ilúvatar added {a mate of female kind,}>other Dwarves {were}that he laid to sleep near to the Fathers.> And Aule returned to Valinor and waited long as best he might. But it is not known when Durin or his brethren first awoke, though some think that it was at the time of the departure of the Eldar over sea.>

The only other open question that I can see in this thread is about how we handle Of Dwarves and Men. I for my part can’t see how we could use the full essay in one place. The most essential parts are what we used here and the passage about the Longbeards and the Northmen in the second age and that about the Drûg. The information of the awakening places of the Dwarves could be told in retrospect, but I don’t see that we could bring the complete essay anywhere near to LotR, where the Drûg part would be helpful as in introduction for the people of the Gâhn-buri-Gâhn. The Alliance of the Longbeards and the Northmen from an essential part of the story in the early Second Age. But in that place we can not use the entire essay either. So for me it is clear that we have to split it and use the parts where they belong chronologically as good as possible.

Respectfully
Findegil

[Aiwendil]

For this chapter, I produced two texts, separating "Of Aule and the Dwarves" from "Of the Ents and the Eagles".

The basic text is the QS77, with only a few alterations and additions. I used "AD" for the text "Of Aule and the Dwarves".

As usual:
Bold Text = source information, comments and remarks
{example} = text that should be deleted
[example] = normalised text, normally only used for general changes
<source example> = additions with source information
example = text inserted for grammatical or metrical reason
/example/ = outline expansion

<AD Of Aulë and the Dwarves>

AD-01<AD The Naugrim are not of the Elf-kind, nor of Man-kind, nor yet of Melkor's breeding; ... to have learners to whom he could teach his lore and his crafts, that he was unwilling to await the fulfilment of the designs of Ilúvatar.>

<QS77 It is told that in their beginning the Dwarves were made by Aule in the darkness of Middle-earth; ...

Now Iluvatar knew what was done, ... And the voice of Iluvatar said to him: AD-02 'Why {hast thou}[have you] done this? Why {dost thou}[do you] attempt a thing which {thou}[you] know{est} is beyond {thy}[your] power and {thy}[your] authority? For {thou hast}[you have] from me as a gift {thy}[your] own being only, and no more; and therefore the creatures of {thy}[your] hand and mind can live only by that being, moving when {thou}[you] think{est} to move them, and if {thy}[your] thought be elsewhere, standing idle. Is that {thy}[your] desire?'

Then Aule answered: 'I did not desire such lordship. I desired things other than I am, to love and to teach them, so that they too might perceive the beauty of Ea, AD-03 which {thou hast}[you have] caused to be. For it seemed ... Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by {thee}[you]; and the child of little understanding ... But what shall I do now, so that {thou}[you] be not angry with me for ever? As a child to his father, I offer to {thee}[you] these things, the work of the hands which {thou hast}[you have] made. Do with them what {thou wilt}[you will]. But should I not rather destroy the work of my presumption?'

Then Aule took up a great hammer to smite the Dwarves; and he wept. ... And the voice of Iluvatar said to Aule: AD-04‘{Thy}[Your] offer I accepted even as it was made. {Dost thou}[Do you] not see that these things have now a life of their own, and speak with their own voices? Else they would not have flinched from {thy}[your] blow, nor from any command of {thy}[your] will.' Then Aule cast down his hammer and was glad, and he gave thanks to Iluvatar, saying: 'May Eru bless my work and amend it!'

But Ilúvatar spoke again and said: 'Even as I gave being ... but in no other way will I amend AD-05 {thy}[your] handiwork, and as {thou hast}[you have] made it, so shall it be. But I will not suffer this: that these should come before the Firstborn of my design, nor that {thy}[your] impatience should be rewarded. ... and until that time {thou}[you] and they shall wait, though long it seem. But when the time comes I will awaken them, and they shall be to {thee}[you] as children; and often strife shall arise between {thine}[yours] and mine, the children of my adoption and the children of my choice.'

Then Aule took the Seven Fathers of the Dwarves, and laid them ...

<LQ And since they AD-06{came}[were to come] in the days of the power of Melkor, Aulë made them strong to endure. ... Then their part shall be to serve Aulë and to aid him in the re-making of Arda after the Last Battle.

AD-07<AD Now these Seven Fathers, they say, return to live again and to bear once more their ancient names>. {Now these Fathers, they say, were seven in number, and they alone return (in the manner of the Quendi) to live again in their own kin and to bear once more their ancient names.} Of these Durin was the most renowned in after ages, father of that Dwarf-kin most friendly to the Elves whose mansions were at Khazad-dûm.

In the darkness of Arda already the Naugrim wrought great works, for they had, even from the first days of their Fathers, ...

The Naugrim were ever, as they still remain, short and squat in stature; they were deep-breasted, strong in the arm, and stout in the leg, and their beards were long. ...

The father-tongue of the Dwarves Aulë himself devised for them, and their languages have thus no kinship with those of the Quendi. ...

In their own tongue the Dwarves name themselves Khazâd; ... and the Gonnhirrim masters of stone AD-08{; and those who dwelt in Belegost they called the Ennfeng or Longbeards, for their beards swept the floor before their feet}. The chief cities of the Khazâd in the west of Middle-earth in those days were at [Khazad-dûm], and at Gabilgathol and Tumunzahar, which are interpreted in the {Gnomish}[Sindarin] tongue Nornhabar the Dwarrowdelf, and Belegost Mickleburg, and Nogrod the Hollowbold. ... There battle later befell; but as yet the Dwarves troubled the Elves little, while the power of the Gnomes lasted.

AD-09Here end the words that {Pengolod}[Thingódhel] {spoke to me}[wrote] concerning the Dwarves, which are not part of the Pennas as it was written, but come from other books of lore, from the Lammas, the Dorgannas, and the Quentalë Ardanómion{: quoth Ælfwine}.>

Comments:

AD-01: This opening paragraph of AD was omitted from QS77.

AD-02: Christopher Tolkien says in XI that his father eventually settled on using the formal, "you", throughout AD, whereas QS77 uses "thou". I have reverted all instances of "thou" to "you".

AD-03: As AD-02

AD-04: As AD-02

AD-05: As AD-02

AD-06: Changed per Tolkien’s emendation to LQ1.

AD-07: Taking the later version of the statement about the Dwarf-fathers returning to life.

AD-08: The "Longbeards" were later the Dwarves of Khazad-dum, not of Belegost.

AD-09: Removal of Aelfwine.

For my text of "Anaxartaron Onyalië", with QS77 as the basis, I will only indicate the beginning, end, and changes, as the rest follows QS77.

<Of the Ents and the Eagles Anaxartaron Onyalië>

Now when Aule laboured in the making of the Dwarves he kept this work hidden from the other Valar; but at last he opened his mind to Yavanna and told her of all that had come to pass. ...

Therefore she went before Manwe, and she did not EE-01{betray}[bewray] the counsel of Aule, but she said: 'King of Arda, is it true, as Aule hath said to me, that the Children when they come shall have dominion over all the things of my labour, to do as they will therewith?'

...

'Yet it was in the Song,' said Yavanna. 'For while thou wert in the heavens and with Ulmo built the clouds and poured out the rains, I lifted up the branches of great trees to receive them, and some sang to EE-02{Ilúvatar}[Eru] amid the wind and the rain.'

...

And at last the Vision was renewed, but it was not now remote, for he was himself within it, and yet he saw that all was upheld by the hand of EE-03{Iluvatar}[Eru]; and the hand entered in, and from it came forth many wonders that had until then been hidden from him in the hearts of the Ainur.

...

'Nonetheless they will have need of wood,' said Aule, and he went on with his smith-work.

Comments:

EE-01: Per XI; ‘betray’ in QS77 was an editorial alteration of ‘bewray’.

EE-02: Per XI, as EE-01; ‘Iluvatar’ in QS77 for original ‘Eru’.

EE-03: As EE-02.