The Shadow of the Maker

[IxnaY AintsaY]

Originally Posted by Belegorn

I think that perhaps Melkor should be included. Although he is said to have "had a share in the gifts of all his brethren" [Silmarillion; Ainulindalë] it is to Aulë that his gifts mirror, "Melkor was jealous of him, for Aulë was most like himself in thought and in powers....Both, also, desired to make things of their own that should be new and unthought of by others, and delighted in the praise of their skill." [Valaquenta]

We could add Eöl, and Maeglin to that list. All "makers" who had a link to Aulë through the Dwarves. Curufin as well, although he likely was taught by Aulë directly, not to mention his own father.

Besides Aulë, are there any examples of craftsmen in Middle-earth of which we know anything at all who are -not- largely corrupted?

Mahtan, I suppose. Any others?

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Originally Posted by IxnaY AintsaY

Besides Aulë, are there any examples of craftsmen in Middle-earth of which we know anything at all who are -not- largely corrupted?

Mahtan, I suppose. Any others?

Turgon?

Moreover, I don't think it's fair to say that Celebrimbor was "largely corrupted;" say rather that he was cozened.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by William Cloud Hicklin

Moreover, I don't think it's fair to say that Celebrimbor was "largely corrupted;" say rather that he was cozened.

To my way of thinking, a "corruption"' would entail drawing one in the opposite direction from one's original intent or inclinations. Therefore, I agree about Celebrimbor. It was when he realized that Sauron had tried to corrupt the Noldor that he repented.

[Pitchwife]

D'accord about Celebrimbor, I don't think he would have gone along with Sauron's plans so far if he had known who or what he was dealing with. But his ambition as a craftsman made him vulnerable to Annatar's promises of improved methods and techniques to fashion artefacts of greater power.

Melkor certainly belongs here as the archetype of the inventor and subcreator gone wrong. (And may I confess that I always had a soft spot for his attempt to turn the Music into free jazz; the desire "to make things of their own that should be new and unthought of by others" is hardly reprehensible by itself in my eyes - isn't that what drives every artist?)

Eöl, hm, I don't know that he really belongs here, and Maeglin neither, as the evil they committed wasn't tied to their craft. They were just artisans who also happened to be evil. While Eöl was possessive as hell and this vice drove him to commit the deeds which led to his and Aredhel's death it wasn't the love of the works of his own hands William Cloud Hicklin mentioned above that did this.

Zigûr, nice observation about the Dwarves! I wonder whether they are largely free of the lust for domination because Aulë made them so, or whether Eru improved a little on Aulë's design when he gave them life.

I'm not so sure about "Knowledge. Rule. Order" - that seems more like a scientist's dream than an artist's to me. "Creative chaos" is a trope for a reason.

One temptation to makers that I see in Fëanor is idolizing the made thing, the artifact, and holding it higher than the art of making itself. He tells the Valar he would never be able to make the likes of the Silmaril again, but he could have moved on to make other interesting things if he hadn't been so obsessed with the Shiners Three. It's said that every artist puts a part of themself into their work, and in Fëanor's case this part was pretty big. (Sauron, of course, is the most extreme example for this, exaggerating the concept almost into parody.)

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Zigûr, nice observation about the Dwarves! I wonder whether they are largely free of the lust for domination because Aulë made them so, or whether Eru improved a little on Aulë's design when he gave them life.

Eru told Aulë that he would give actual life to the Dwarves, but would in no other way "amend" them. So I think that Aulë's intention in their making, of merely wanting students to teach and not to dominate, was a large factor in their being free of the desire themselves to dominate.

[Zigûr]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

I'm not so sure about "Knowledge. Rule. Order" - that seems more like a scientist's dream than an artist's to me. "Creative chaos" is a trope for a reason.

That's true. In Professor Tolkien's work, though, I feel like there's something of a parallel, and that the line between artistry and science is blurred into a more general sort of "artisanship". It reminds me of the statement he makes in Letter 154 about the intended effect of the Elven Rings upon Eregion (and Middle-earth in general) in the minds of the Gwaith-i-Mírdain, that they:

tried to stop its change and history, stop its growth, keep it as a pleasaunce, even largely a desert, where they could be 'artists'

Thus I feel that an artist in Middle-earth could also desire control.

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Originally Posted by Zigûr

That's true. In Professor Tolkien's work, though, I feel like there's something of a parallel, and that the line between artistry and science is blurred into a more general sort of "artisanship". It reminds me of the statement he makes in Letter 154 about the intended effect of the Elven Rings upon Eregion (and Middle-earth in general) in the minds of the Gwaith-i-Mírdain, that they:

Thus I feel that an artist in Middle-earth could also desire control.

Tolkien made a distinction often between "pure" and "applied" science, or between science and engineering; the difference between the Ents and Entwives he likened to that between Botany and Agronomy.

He had little issue with the sort of "science", scientia, Knowledge, which seeks merely to understand, but he had no love at all for "minds of metal and wheels" which sought to control, making the desires of the Will into concrete reality-- whether through iron machinery or through "magic." (Compare also Galadriel's distinction between "Elvish magic" and "the deceits of the Enemy," in light of Tolkien's discussion in OFS of faerian drama.)

Celebrimbor and the Mirdain drifted from the former towards the latter- a constant temptation for the Noldor, whose bent always was towards stone and metal and their properties and manipulation, as opposed to, say, the Sindar whose concern was more for the kelvar and olvar of the world, which bred an Entish sort of attitude.

[IxnaY AintsaY]

Originally Posted by William Cloud Hicklin

Turgon?

Moreover, I don't think it's fair to say that Celebrimbor was "largely corrupted;" say rather that he was cozened.

Good point about Celebrimbor. Maybe a better way to word the question would be "What examples of makers are there who were not either largely corrupted by or deeply entangled in the designs of evil?"

("Entanglement" is a little problematic considering the overarching nature of evil in Arda, but Celebrimbor has ...culpability on a different scale than, say, Galadriel.)

Turgon--was he a craftsman? Or are you referring to his presumed abilities as a noteworthy urban planner? :P

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Originally Posted by IxnaY AintsaY

Turgon--was he a craftsman? Or are you referring to his presumed abilities as a noteworthy urban planner? :P

Turgon wrought Belthil and Glingal, the silver and gold replicas of Telperion and Laurelin in Gondolin.