Three Times The Hobbit?

[Pomegranate]

I am looking forward to this. I'm pretty excited about seeing a continuation of the Peter Jackson Middle-Earth - for me different from the Tolkien Middle-Earth, but still well-beloved. I was perhaps more excited about seeing a Guillermo del Toro Middle Earth, for it would've been fun to have several different 'canon to the movie-goers' worlds; Now it's just Pete's view, which is sad, but which is still such a big part of my childhood and my Tolkien experience that I'm excited.

However, what I will miss, what I think PJ could've never produced due to his image of Middle-Earth leaning to such an opposite direction, but what for me is a very intrinsic part of The Hobbit, is the lack of too much destiny and doom. This is represented in a quote by Frodo in LOTR.

"Of course, I have sometimes thought of going away, but I imagined that as a kind of holiday, a series of adventures like Bilbo's or better, ending in peace."

The forthcoming movie with "Why the hobbit, Gandalf"'s and "You didn't promise that I would come back"s and "Nor will I be responsible for his fate"s feels way too grand and massive. I was fine with the idea that they'd put some of the Necromancer-stuff in, but including the silly adventure of the dvarves in this greater scheme of things, in this talk of dooms and fates and you will never be the sames, just feels a bit wrong. I guess this is the situation of it being a children's book but definitely not a children's film. I guess it has to be accepted, given how this was clearly made as a prequel to the LOTR movies, and how it thus needs to have a similar mood in order to attract the same group of fans. But I'll miss it, and I hope that one day the filming rights will be released and someone makes a good, and a not too doomy children's film out of The Hobbit. The book deserves it.

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Pomegranate

I hope that one day the filming rights will be released and someone makes a good, and a not too doomy children's film out of The Hobbit. The book deserves it.

It was done years ago, but not as live action. Google "Rankin Bass Hobbit".

[Mithalwen]

http://www.economist.com/blogs/prosp...disappointment

[Inziladun]

Sounds like a familiar refrain.

The trouble starts when Mr Jackson starts to shoehorn in the back story. Many wondered how the director would get three films out of a 272-page book. Now they know. It makes some sense to put the dwarves’ quest into the larger context of the gathering storm in Middle Earth—the parallel activities of elves and wizards are sprinkled throughout the book and Tolkien indulged his imagination further in a lengthy appendix to “The Lord of the Rings”. But Mr Jackson has avidly seized on this material and dropped it in rather clunkily.

You know, why couldn't they have started the tale by taking a cue from UT's The Quest of Erebor? Just have Frodo, Sam, and Gimli talking together in Minas Tirith after Sauron's fall, and have someone ask why Bilbo was chosen by Gandalf. Gimli and Gandalf could have quickly set the stage, and then cut to Bilbo at Bag End.
Too simple for the likes of PJ?

[radagastly]

Originally posted by Inziladun:

You know, why couldn't they have started the tale by taking a cue from UT's The Quest of Erebor? Just have Frodo, Sam, and Gimli talking together in Minas Tirith after Sauron's fall, and have someone ask why Bilbo was chosen by Gandalf. Gimli and Gandalf could have quickly set the stage, and then cut to Bilbo at Bag End.

Since the Tolkien estate still owns the film rights to all of the books published after Tolkien's death, any scene like that, or even remotely similar, might well open up P.J. and New Line to law suits for copyright infringment, quite different from the "creative accounting" lawsuits previously imposed on them, especially considering the contentious relationship they already enjoy with the Tolkien estate.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by radagastly

Since the Tolkien estate still owns the film rights to all of the books published after Tolkien's death, any scene like that, or even remotely similar, might well open up P.J. and New Line to law suits for copyright infringment, quite different from the "creative accounting" lawsuits previously imposed on them, especially considering the contentious relationship they already enjoy with the Tolkien estate.

True, that. Maybe that's an instant when co-operation by the Estate could have made all the movies better. But then they'd have expected some concessions from the filmmakers too. Irresistible force, meet immovable object.

[davem]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

True, that. Maybe that's an instant when co-operation by the Estate could have made all the movies better. But then they'd have expected some concessions from the filmmakers too. Irresistible force, meet immovable object.

My feeling is that both sides have been too bloody minded. The Estate could have given more & been less 'precious' about the works - the films have meant a great deal to a great many people & its not as if the film-makers have bought up every copy of the books & torched them. At the same time the film makers seem to have revelled in their belief that they know better than Tolkien & gone ahead & made changes in both storyline & tone which they must have known would antagonise CT. CT has shown himself very willing in the past to help out with dramatising his father's work. My suspicion is that if the film-makers had approached him for help he would have been willing - but then they would have had to give way to him in certain aspects of the adaptation.

For those interested in the part CT played in helping the adaptors of the BBC Radio series of LotR back in the early 80's, here's Brian Sibley (one of the adaptors along with Michael Bakewell) discussing Christopher's help (including allowing them to use material from UT in their adaptation) as well as an excerpt from a tape CT sent them to help with pronunciations http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5spIPrF_PPE&feature=plcp

[Kuruharan]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

You know, why couldn't they have started the tale by taking a cue from UT's The Quest of Erebor? Just have Frodo, Sam, and Gimli talking together in Minas Tirith after Sauron's fall, and have someone ask why Bilbo was chosen by Gandalf. Gimli and Gandalf could have quickly set the stage, and then cut to Bilbo at Bag End.
Too simple for the likes of PJ?

Aside from the (rather more serious and important reasons already listed) you could never have gotten John Rhys-Davies back into his Gimli makeup.

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

http://www.economist.com/blogs/prosp...disappointment

"The LotR trilogy was close to perfect"

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

"The LotR trilogy was close to perfect"

"fiasco."

[TheMisfortuneTeller]

Someone else may have already done this. If so, I apologize for any redundancy. Otherwise, a much younger Mr Spock (who had his own pointy-ears issues) sings all one needs to know about The Hobbit. Someone in the comments section of the Economist review posted the link. Economical in the extreme, and absolutely horrible as music, it nonetheless succinctly summarizes the essential narrative.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2HQ1K7YyQM

Somehow, I suspect that when I get around to seeing Peter Jackson's impression of George Lucas doing Middle Earth: Episode I (with Chinese subtitles here in Kaohsiung, Taiwan), I'll wish I had seen a movie version of the song instead.

Three years of insufferable marketing and celebrity/fan-fiction hype to endure, only to spend nine hours having to figure out just what happened to Tolkien's coherent little two-and-a-half hour story about the hobbit Bilbo Baggins. On the positive side, I understand that Andy Serkis as the schizoid Smeagol/Gollum comes in about two hours into the movie and somewhat rescues the floundering enterprise. So I guess I'll have to content myself with that. What Middle Earth: Episode II and Middle Earth: Episode III will do without the tortured little freak, I have no idea. Something awful keeps suggesting to me that Prince Legolas and the elf chick security guard Itaril/Tauriel may try to fill the void. The action-figure elvish Ken and Barbie dolls now on sale only seem to corroborate this dreadful prospect.

Oh, well ...

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

"The LotR trilogy was close to perfect"

It seems pretty much *all* critics who have reviewed The Hobbit are major fans of the Lord of the Rings movies– which has already led many an aggrieved fanboy to accuse them of bias on account of "unrealistic expectations". (Can't win, really.)

[Mithalwen]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

It seems pretty much *all* critics who have reviewed The Hobbit are major fans of the Lord of the Rings movies– which has already led many an aggrieved fanboy to accuse them of bias on account of "unrealistic expectations". (Can't win, really.)

And of course the expectations couldn't have been raised by the Jackson cultists who decreed that whatever PJ decided would be all for the best in the best of all possible Middle Earthes.

My own expectations seem to being confirmrd. And since I loathe SerkisGollum and find the music soupy.... don't think I will be making the trek to the multiplex yet.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

"The LotR trilogy was close to perfect"

Hoot! Maybe this is PJ's plan to make us all much fonder of LotR.

[Morthoron]

Originally Posted by alatar

Hoot! Maybe this is PJ's plan to make us all much fonder of LotR.

Peter Jackson: Lord of the Revision.

[Aeglos]

I have seen the movie. Not sure if this is the right place to post. But i think it was really good. Its not as epic as lotr, but its more down to earth and more fairytale-ish. Some things are changed in the story to make a more "hollywood" movie, but its rly close to what i imagined when i read the book. Its pretty close!

PJ made some changes and added something aswell, and i rly dont think he failed it was a nice "try" to expand tolkiens world, and people will critizise him for it, but i think its good that someone tries atleast. Blown away by the film, the music wasnt all that. But ok.