Werewolves, Vampires and other creatures?

[Puddleglum]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Gandalf seems to have thought Smaug would have acted for Sauron, though whether he would have done so willingly is up in the air. In fact, that was given in Unfinished Tales as one of Gandalf's prime motives in helping Thorin retake Erebor.

It may be just your wording (if so, my apologies in advance) but I think Gandalf's statement was nuanced a bit differently when he said, in UT, "The dragon, Sauron might use with terrible effect."
"Would have acted for Sauron" implies, to me, that Smaug would have been concious of acting to aid Sauron (whether willingly or not). From Gandalf's word choice, there is an additional possibility that Sauron might manage to manipulate Smaug to actions that aid him without Smaug even realizing (or caring) that he is doing so.

'Course, if by "acted for Sauron" you merely meant "acted in ways that happened to benefit Sauron" (as opposed to "acted conciously for the benefit of Sauron") then I'd agree with you, but the wording "seemed" to not include unintentional (even unknowing) support as a result of being manipulated.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Puddleglum

It may be just your wording (if so, my apologies in advance) but I think Gandalf's statement was nuanced a bit differently when he said, in UT, "The dragon, Sauron might use with terrible effect."

There is no comma at that place in the original quote.

Originally Posted by Puddleglum

"Would have acted for Sauron" implies, to me, that Smaug would have been concious of acting to aid Sauron (whether willingly or not). From Gandalf's word choice, there is an additional possibility that Sauron might manage to manipulate Smaug to actions that aid him without Smaug even realizing (or caring) that he is doing so.

I think either scenario is possible, but as I said, it doesn't seem too much of a stretch that Smaug would have willingly aided Sauron, with some appropriate motivation especially.

If that failed, Sauron was surely capable of bringing about some circumstance that would have galvanized an unaware Smaug to destructive action against the West or its allies.

[Galadriel55]

When I first saw the title I thought it was this thread.


I agree that Smaug probably would have unconsciously aided Sauron. He would have a role kind of like Shelob's - except that he most likely wouldn't know about what service he's doing at all. But even if he did, he would still rain destruction for his own sake and not give two cents of his treasure for Sauron's sake.

[Puddleglum]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

There is no comma at that place in the original quote.

Quite true! (as I see now that I am home with my books) I was quoting from memory -- actually got closer to the quote than I expected (:-)