Native Language is not the same as Cradle Language - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Galadriel55 · 06-24-2012, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCRmyGirl4eva

Galadriel 55, I know what you're talking about. I have a friend at school who immigrated from Russia, and though she is perfectly fluent in English, (her parents don't speak a word of it, though) when she gets mad, it becomes hard to understand her accent.

Hmm... When I get mad I can yell in any language, without accents. It's just when I speak to a Russian-speaking person that I can't utter a word in English without that accent creeping in, regardless of the conversation or emotions.

This doesn't really prove anything about native vs cradle languages, though.

Lalwendë · 06-25-2012, 01:50 PM

There's two interpretations as I see it, both picked up on here: that he is referring to languages you don't necessarily 'know'; and that he is also referring to how an individual may speak a language with a very particular dialect.

In my own experience, I fell down with French, the verbs are utterly alien and I'm unable to pronounce it without feeling like a prize prat, but I can muddle on with German quite happily, it's almost instinctive (though probably grammatically incorrect). I have put that down to it being much closer to English, and also easier for someone with a northern tongue to speak. Northerners speak with an open mouth and get their tongue around words (as though munching a meat & tater pie

), much as you do with German, whereas a lot of southerners talk 'far back' and swallow half the letters rather than speak them - this is more suited to pronouncing the Romance/Latin languages.

As for dialects and accents, I use both. I find I try to speak more clearly when dealing with people who speak RP, unless they annoy me, in which case my obstinate genes kick in and I slip back into broad Lancastrian

I have perfect understanding of some of the most difficult British accents but struggle with anyone who talks far back. English has hundreds of varieties, even within England. If this is what Tolkien means, i.e. the difference between standard English and regional English, then I know exactly what he means.

06-25-2012, 01:50 PM	#2
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	There's two interpretations as I see it, both picked up on here: that he is referring to languages you don't necessarily 'know'; and that he is also referring to how an individual may speak a language with a very particular dialect. In my own experience, I fell down with French, the verbs are utterly alien and I'm unable to pronounce it without feeling like a prize prat, but I can muddle on with German quite happily, it's almost instinctive (though probably grammatically incorrect). I have put that down to it being much closer to English, and also easier for someone with a northern tongue to speak. Northerners speak with an open mouth and get their tongue around words (as though munching a meat & tater pie ), much as you do with German, whereas a lot of southerners talk 'far back' and swallow half the letters rather than speak them - this is more suited to pronouncing the Romance/Latin languages. As for dialects and accents, I use both. I find I try to speak more clearly when dealing with people who speak RP, unless they annoy me, in which case my obstinate genes kick in and I slip back into broad Lancastrian I have perfect understanding of some of the most difficult British accents but struggle with anyone who talks far back. English has hundreds of varieties, even within England. If this is what Tolkien means, i.e. the difference between standard English and regional English, then I know exactly what he means. __________________ Gordon's alive!