Noldor or Numenoreans

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

However, we do notice that those who are strong are held in honour as much as those with other attributes.

I think Tolkien's ideas about chivalry and the right duty of a leader come into play here, as he examined it in "The Homecoming of Beorhtnoth, Beorhthelm's Son".

Originally Posted by Hobbit-fan

Assuming that Gil-Gilad possessed such fire which made him formidable, I am assuming that since Elendil possessed it not, he was also able to melee Sauron though brute physical force. They threw down Sauron and slew him together even though they both perished in the process.

It wasn't Elendil's physical strength which enabled him to escape the fall of Numenor.

I think you are right that Tolkien uses the word "power' quite often, but his concept of power might include more than just physical might.

[Hobbitt_Fan]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

I think Tolkien's ideas about chivalry and the right duty of a leader come into play here, as he examined it in "The Homecoming of Beorhtnoth, Beorhthelm's Son".




It wasn't Elendil's physical strength which enabled him to escape the fall of Numenor.

I think you are right that Tolkien uses the word "power' quite often, but his concept of power might include more than just physical might.

I see what you are saying. Hurin could be one the characters where you definitely see the intertwining of strength of arm and will. The same could be said of others.

I do think physical strength was important to his view of ability. In the Fall of Gondolin, he makes a point to mention Rog is the strongest of the Noldor in a physical sense. He further makes a point of the physical strength of Rog's house when they sally forth in their last stand.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Hobbitt_Fan

I see what you are saying. Hurin could be one the characters where you definitely see the intertwining of strength of arm and will.

The will is more iportant here, although the strength is also great.

[Hobbitt_Fan]

I agree and I understand Tolkien's use of strength in a spiritual or meta-physical way.

I brought this up in the novice section because it sounds like a vs. thread but I really am interested in terms of physical strength how the great Noldo Lords of the first age and the Mighty of Numenor or the 1st age Edain from the House of Hador stack up.

I know in the Children of Hurin, when Turin humiliates and accidentally causes Saeros death, it state he is stronger than any Elf.

[Galadriel55]

Tuor is said to be stronger than any Elf of Doriath except for Beleg, but he is one individual compared to the majority that is probably weaker than most Elves.

[Hobbitt_Fan]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Tuor is said to be stronger than any Elf of Doriath except for Beleg, but he is one individual compared to the majority that is probably weaker than most Elves.

Tuor or Turin? If Turin, I think at that point in the book he is only 17 and not yet in the fullness of his manhood. I wonder if Hurin had not convinces Turgon to withdraw during Nírnaeth Arnoediad, could Turgon have matched his feat? Or could have Hurin called out Morgoth to a duel and matched his feat?

The greatest of the Noldo Lords are said to be the tallest children of Illuvitar. The Noldo are said to be strong of arm and powerful of build, gifted in both craft and war, so that has me leaning that as great as Hurin or Turin were, they couldn't match a Turgon, Gil-Gilad, Fingolfin, Fingon, Argon, Maedhros, Rog, Glorfinedel, or Echtellion in feats of arms. That they are just a level of being above even the greats like Hurin, Turin, or Elendil.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Hobbitt_Fan

Tuor or Turin?

My bad, it is Turin. However, I think that even when he grew up fully Beleg was still stronger and more skilled than him.