A Measure of Success

[Durelin]

Originally Posted by Form

but I don't think the overall style of playing is really being brought into question.

I didn't know that line had been drawn.

Originally Posted by Form

In other words, I think we're quibbling more over how the formulation of the rules will match the unspoken habits of using other characters that are already in play, rather than revising the rule structure to reflect a whole new way of thinking.

Instead revise the rule structure to reflect unspoken habits that may or may not be shared by every player? And new players must conform to these unspoken habits? I mean, there's rules to help things go smoothly, and then there's rules that tell you how you should write, how you should RP, etc. The Downs is going to maintain a certain style regardless of how many unspoken habits you do or don't put into the rules. I guess it's how far you want to go. To be honest I just didn't know that not using someone's character without their permission is an entirely new way of thinking.

I'll go away now. Promise.

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Durelin

I didn't know that line had been drawn.

My apologies then--perhaps it hasn't been explicitly drawn. Nonetheless, without anyone having drawn a precise line, it seems to me that a realistic appraisal of the situation yields the same results: we're talking about a change to RPing, as it is played on the Downs. This discussion involves Downer RPers, under the eyes of the Downer mods and admins. What's more, with the possible (probable?) exception of yourself, no one has really been agitating for a complete levelling of the way RPs are played on the Downs. Instead, the majority of the discussion has focused on how to streamline what we already have.

Maybe I'm the only one who sees it this way--and in that case, more people ought to speak up and tell me so--but in simplest terms, we're not building a new forum; we're modifying the one we have.

Originally Posted by Durelin

Instead revise the rule structure to reflect unspoken habits that may or may not be shared by every player?

Not every player may share these "unspoken habits," but I sincerely hope that the attempts at revising the rules don't make it appear that people have to use other player's characters extensively in their posts. The rules, as they stand, say that you can't use someone else's character. The practice--what you're calling unspoken habits--is that we do use each other's characters, cautiously and sparingly in most cases, or more extensively when we know them better, always open to adjustment at the behest of the other character's player. The revision of this rule insofar as anyone seems to be talking about it would not impose any new burden of interaction on players who try not to use other people's characters, but would turn the currently illicit, but de facto situation of shared character use into a de iure case.

Originally Posted by Durelin

And new players must conform to these unspoken habits?

These unspoken habits, in my experience, are what happen after two players and their two characters have played together for a while--the players learn what they can reasonably do with someone else's character, and end up using them accordingly--beyond the limits proscribed by the current law. Extending the bounds of the current law to include what is already happening does not force new players to play right out to those limits. On the contrary, it gives them the confidence and freedom to know that they are not going to be blithely struck down if they so much as use someone else's concierge to sign them into a hotel lobby.

Originally Posted by Durelin

I mean, there's rules to help things go smoothly, and then there's rules that tell you how you should write, how you should RP, etc. The Downs is going to maintain a certain style regardless of how many unspoken habits you do or don't put into the rules. I guess it's how far you want to go. To be honest I just didn't know that not using someone's character without their permission is an entirely new way of thinking.

If I may make a candid, and possibly erroneous observation, Durelin, your biggest issue seems to be that "the Downs is going to maintain a certain style regardless"--and I am inferring that you think this is not an entirely good thing. Perhaps this is the whole problem here: unlike you (assuming I read you right), I want the Downs to maintain the good elements of its "certain style." What's more, I get the impression that most of the people commenting on this thread want to maintain what they think the good elements of Downsian roleplaying are. As a result, while maybe there is no "line drawn," it seems patently likely that the new Downs forums will resemble the old.