Game Thread: WW LXXXVI - The Halls of Mandos

[A Little Green]

Some scattered comments.

What's more, I'm speaking for the good of the village in mind - and everyone reading back what I've said and thinking about it sees it is true. But if Shasta is a wolf, he knows I'm speaking against their interest. And if tp is an innocent too (a view I'm slightly leaning over right now even if I can't be totally positive about it), then any trust forming between the innocents would be bad for the wolves. So those people should be done away with asap.

This is making me raise my eyebrows a bit, especially the first sentence. I'm not sure about Nog otherwise, I wonder if a Nogwolf would be so aggressive.

Originally Posted by Boro

I find myself having trouble concentrating anything after being referred to as Bobbler. Nice one Greenie.

I'm here to serve.

Originally Posted by Agan

At the moment I'm inclined to say one of Lommy and Greenie is a baddie. Lommy was looking cobblerish, but it was actually only after Greenie pointed it out that peoples started suspecting her. The problem with Greenie is, she's being too nice to me. She questioned me a bit but dropped it quickly and said she's okay with me. Usually when we're both innocent this bickering continues for a few days after which we basically trust each other. But now she seems different - you know, accusing me just for the sake of doing it and stopping it before I retaliate.

I can assure you I'm just as surprised as you are. You've misread me at some point though because I don't think I accused you yesterDay at all. (But if it consoles you, I'm starting to get paranoid about you because I think you're being too nice as well - as in, you haven't annoyed me once! )

Originally Posted by Boro

Edit: correcting typo of "killer beers" to "killer bees"

If I could rep you for a typo, I would.

Originally Posted by Wilwa, about Glirdan

However, I think he could be a Cobbler, who was trying to hint to the wolves.

I was thinking the same. What Agan said - it would be odd from an innocent to say someone behaves the same way they did when they were the Seer - but a wolf would have to be very careless or very bold to do that.

Originally Posted by Agan

Not interested in getting rid of Mänwe so much as saving a potential cobbler or two.

You seem awfully sure none of the other lynch candidates was a wolf.

Originally Posted by Fea

I agree on the first two. Not so much on the last. Shasta is the only one (or one of the only; too lazy to check my stats) that showed a pronounced attack on anybody. And that person was Nog. So my general idea is either Nog is a wolf and the team thought maybe Shasticle was the Seer, since he was actually showing some initiative and some specific ire... or (and this is the one I lean toward), the wolf team noticed that Shasta was showing pronounced opinions, and that if they killed him, the village would think they killed him because they thought he was the seer.

I might be totally off with this - too lazy to go back and check - but I got the impression that Shasta was after phantom quite as much as Nog. That would make the scenario of a Shasta-Seer who dreamed Nog quite improbable.

Originally Posted by Agan

She went consistently after Lommy since her first post. I find the vote somewhat fishy though. Granted, I see what she means about Lommy but she seems to explain her vote in more length than necessary - no one expects day 1 votes to be fully reasoned.

Which means they shouldn't be? I could have simply said "see my previous posts for reasons" but since I hate it when others do that I resolved not to do it myself.

Originally Posted by Nog

And I do doubt that somone with Shasta's experience would just go crazy about that kind of one suspicion on him (mine, that is), especially if he was a gifted as that woud be like calling the wolves to meet him during the Night - just to take the most promising choice.

The way I saw it, Shasta's strong reaction to your vote for him wasn't so much going crazy because he was suspected, but being insulted by your phrasing.

Originally Posted by Lommy

Mänwë was suspicious enough to merit one vote, but definitely not a bandwagon.

Generally, voting for someone means you want them killed. If you think someone merits one vote, they just as well merit a bandwagon of them. I don't know if I'm making any sense at all.


EDIT: x-ed with Nog, a big Lommy and a host of phantoms

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by A Little Green

I might be totally off with this - too lazy to go back and check - but I got the impression that Shasta was after phantom quite as much as Nog. That would make the scenario of a Shasta-Seer who dreamed Nog quite improbable.

I should clarify. I don't think Shasta was the Seer. But I do think our wolf pack is just lazy enough to swipe his behavior as an easy way to get the village to target Nog. Whether or not Nog is evil is irrelevant. The point is more that if we spend all of our time asking if Shasta was the seer or not, we won't be looking for other seer hints, we won't be searching for wolves, and we'll blow an entire Day talking about something that all boils down to the wolves taking the easy way out on choosing a kill.

Originally Posted by Ang

As we both know, you tend to exaggerate rather than depreciate your minions' enemies' numbers! Your game was great, but I will always regret not persuading your own village to lynch you, 'Dark Lady'.

Indeed. There were only two. I just didn't tell you they died immediately and let y'all keep going.

And I was just going to casually include some lines from one (any, really) of the Dark Lady sonnets, but they're all about love and I don't want to leave false trails. Just know, village, that I'm feeling nostalgic about that game.

Originally Posted by Lommy

You're not serious, are you? Last time I checked, wolves weren't allowed to go kamikaze.

I'm dead serious. I just don't actually know if anybody has ever tried it. The only game where it would be at all beneficial is one like this, where roles aren't revealed.

Originally Posted by Ang

I talk about the Dead Thread because I'm interested in it. Aren't you?

Absolutely. It's all brand shiny new and I'm too honorable to look at it. Which means it's driving me crazy. Nilp me, let me learn! (Not really. I'm just curious.)

Originally Posted by Phanty Pants

I'm unsure of what "distracting" you think I'm doing, penguin-breath. Is there only one thing we're allowed to talk about and anything else is a "distraction"? Frankly, when it comes to providing thoughts and feelings towards others I think I've done as much as anyone.

Someone sounds defensive...

Originally Posted by Lommy

More like, camp one says Day1 is important both then and especially in retrospect, while camp two says Day1 sucks excpet maybe in retrospect.

Yup.

Originally Posted by Lommy

Eh? I think in this game all the Days are more or less like regular Day1s so I can't see what's the big difference.

Even without knowing the roles of the people we lynch, we can still ascertain the patterns of voting that led to lynches. For instance, phantom voting to avoid a double lynch even though it meant he didn't vote for his stated suspects makes phantom look good, because he could have just let multiple people die, but did not do so. The role of who died is irrelevant, the point is that phantom prevented a group lynch. That makes him look good.

Mithalwen, on the other hand, for attempting to provoke a multi-lynch, looks pretty bad.

Who voted for Manwe and what were their reasons? It doesn't matter that we don't know who he is, because we still have a traceable set of actions that led up to his departure and relocation.

Shasta. We don't know his role, but we know that he's probably not a wolf (because, let's face it, I doubt the wolves would try suicide if I wasn't one of them, offering it up). Therefore, we can look at reasons why not-wolf-Shasta would be targeted at Night. We can look at the people he interacted with. Or we can shrug it off and call it a random kill job.

The point is that we are still capable of identifying pieces of information and analyzing them. We just don't have all of the information handed to us.

Originally Posted by Agan

I wanted to see reactions to Shasta's death before revealing (especially Nog's), and I rather didn't wait till tomorrow just on the offhand chance the wolves decided to target me. I'm not much wiser, except I am not feeling in any way better about Nog.

So if I'm remembering right, we'll be getting Shasta back for a little while?

Originally Posted by Lommy

Somehow makes me less suspicious of Nog though. Looks more like he was framed now (although the wolves don't really know anymore than us others). Hmm, wait, not sure if my own logic makes sense.

Makes no difference.

Originally Posted by Ang

Final, frivolous consideration - interest in the Dead Thread is a character thing. Fea's got it too. We're the kind of people who would have been preeetty untrustworthy around the Ring

Nah. It's not mine, so I won't take it no matter how much I want it. I'm good at just shutting off that part of my mind. Since we can't do anything about anybody else's behavior, there's no sense in dwelling on whether or not people naughtily know more than we do. We should just play assuming they don't.