Werewolf LXXXI: Under the Misty Mountains - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

the phantom · 09-15-2010, 05:07 PM

What's the obsession with balance anyway? Do you honestly want balance?! We ought to wish for lopsided domination by the orcs! Who cares how many votes I have so long as you don't think I'm a SoE (which I'm not).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasta

How are we to analyze votes tomorrow were everyone to say "oh, disregard yesterday's vote, it was simply random"? It's insanely easy for a wolf to hide behind such a move, and it gets the town nowhere with analyses and such. I fail to see why you wish to deny information to the town, Phantom.

Ah, but who would truly accept such reasoning tomorrow? I mean, heck, you're already suspicious of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasta

I have yet to see an actual full-fledged reason for them other than the fact that, well, you're you

And what's wrong with that anyway? Perhaps Lottie thought, "All right then, I'll play his game. Let's see where he's trying to go with this." For all I know Lottie and Sally are testing me with the power and will come out against me tomorrow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasta

Voting for someone based solely on the strength of A) their personality and B) what they've done in past games is stupid, sorry. I love Sally and Lottie to pieces, but it was.

Past behaviors are not to be completely ignored, nor is personality. Those things always factor in at some level when you are with familiar faces, and so I think it is rather harsh to accuse them of being stupid when, to this point, they and Mira are the only villagers that I know for a fact have voted for a true orc and not a SoE.

Shastanis Althreduin · 09-15-2010, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantom

they and Mira are the only villagers that I know for a fact have voted for a true orc and not a SoE.

And you can't expect us to be led around by the nose and believe you when you say that.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 09-15-2010, 05:20 PM

I am basically half asleep already... so... the idea is... will anybody vote for Foley if I do? That's my dilemma. Otherwise, Greenie's been voted for, I could vote Izzy, but she seems to have some support possible from several people, Nerwen and wilwa possibly too, whatever...

So should I be brave and point people towards Folwren instead of just talking about it, or go with somebody else - probably Nerwen...

Celuien · 09-15-2010, 05:46 PM

That was quite a twisty read - quicker to get lost in that than in the tunnels. Sorry if I repeat things, as I'll admit some of it ended up getting skimmed.

My thoughts on whom I'd like to see as a representative at this point...

I want orcs with minds of their own. The SoE are a sneaky group of rats and I'd think that even with this representative system, louder members of the group are apt to try to steer voting, especially in the chaos of the first days. That said, I equally dislike having the votes being dominated by a few since that sets up far too easy a hiding place for quiet orc-killers. And a position with all of the power concentrated in one place would be tempting for the tricky, loud, steering SoE, if they exist.

I find nothing odd about tp's campaign to lead, but I don't think it helps me decide if he's a true orc or not. In any case, I think that debate has been discussed extensively enough above, and I'm not inclined to go there again.

Quote:

Would you like to see me dressed up a certain way in a picture? Perhaps you'd like me to visit? Or you'd like me to never visit? Or would you just like to receive some cold hard cash in the mail? I am absolutely willing to negotiate. Name the price of your vote.

Cel- I'll buy you another one of those awesome outfits you wore on New Years.

As much as I would like to accept (oh, for a visit or photo!), I'm afraid I can't today because I do want to spread some of the representing vote power around and because I want to get more discussion and voting trails for tomorrow.

For the rep vote, I don't think I will go with Boro. I don't want the rest of the day to become a Boro vs Phantom match. So I'd like to go with one of the quieter (so it seems at this point) and more difficult to read members of the group.

++ Foley for rep

More in a bit. I'm sure the talk has been continuing while I was typing...

the phantom · 09-15-2010, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inzil

Why?

It goes back to that tantrum I threw at the beginning- the fact that we orcs are the bad guys, and I'm sick of this wishy-washy nonsense about trying to paint ourselves as the good guys. Let's be bad and enjoy it, I say! And Cel came right in displaying that attitude, and it made me smile. So yeah, no other reason than that.

the phantom · 09-15-2010, 05:29 PM

Shasta- you don't have to have 100% proof of that statement to understand that the point is a nice support for my overall argument. The fact is, what they decided to do had just as much chance of yielding positive results as whatever they would've attempted later in the day, and from my unique perspective I can see quite clearly that they at the least elected an orc. What else do you want me to say?

Shastanis Althreduin · 09-15-2010, 05:38 PM

Quote:

The fact is, what they decided to do had just as much chance of yielding positive results as whatever they would've attempted later in the day

This is flawed. Sure, if you want to go by pure statistics, then yes, you can say this. However, this game is not played on statistics alone. If it was, we'd all be accountants, and I wouldn't be playing because I hate math. The fact is, Sally and Lottie both voted before any information could be gathered, based on nothing from inside this particular game. You may say that this fact is irrelevant all you like, the fact is that it's not irrelevant at all. Yes, it's possible that you're innocent and that from your point of view, Sally and Lottie (and Mira) have voted for an orc. However, no one else (not even they) can be for sure that you're an orc, unless they're an elf. And before you reiterate your previous argument, let me state that both Sally and Lottie voted for you before you even showed up, which means they had no in-game basis for voting you, and Mira admittedly read nothing of the thread before voting you so she's basically in the same boat. The fact that they voted you does not mean that they're innocent - in fact I think it points at just the opposite - and I fail to see why you consistently defend them for such an anti-town play.

Shastanis Althreduin · 09-15-2010, 05:40 PM

++Izzy

Shastanis Althreduin · 09-15-2010, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myself

and I fail to see why you consistently defend them for such an anti-town play.

Addendum - unless it's of course that they voted for you, and your "knight in shining armor" syndrome is kicking in.

the phantom · 09-15-2010, 05:58 PM

Ah, well, you seem to have given part of my answer for me, Shasta. Since I did in fact promise protection to them, I do feel honor bound to give it this day. But the biggest reason for my defense is simply the number of people who thought it very telling. I mean, it's the sort of thing that logically is easy to wave off given the reasoning I have provided, and yet people have remained firm even after I've pointed out these things I never imagined I'd have to bother with.

Really, in a typical village I'd expect there to be far more people than me saying, "Bah, it's Day 1. It's a blind shot anyway, so why not go unconventional just this once?" Given past games and behaviors I would have expected a village to have a mix of reactions from "That's annoying!" to "What the heck?" to "Oh well, just being silly". I've been doing this long enough that I can see reactions come ahead of time quite often, and I can tell you the reactions to Sally and Lottie have surprised me, and makes me suspect something or other is off.

the phantom · 09-15-2010, 06:01 PM

Got to run off now. I'd better go ahead and vote.

++Celuien for rep

Because she acts like an orc, and I'd like to see her active in the second part of the day.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 09-15-2010, 05:44 PM

Okay, I really cannot think anymore, and since nobody seems to help me with the particular concern I have now, I will go to sleep now. And since Izzy already got the vote too, then it is clearly of my other options,

++Nerwen for rep

Good night.

Celuien · 09-15-2010, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the phantom

It goes back to that tantrum I threw at the beginning- the fact that we orcs are the bad guys, and I'm sick of this wishy-washy nonsense about trying to paint ourselves as the good guys. Let's be bad and enjoy it, I say! And Cel came right in displaying that attitude, and it made me smile. So yeah, no other reason than that.

Haha! Or rather, mwhahaha. None of this "good" nonsense. That sounds like elf talk.

09-15-2010, 05:20 PM	#3
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	I am basically half asleep already... so... the idea is... will anybody vote for Foley if I do? That's my dilemma. Otherwise, Greenie's been voted for, I could vote Izzy, but she seems to have some support possible from several people, Nerwen and wilwa possibly too, whatever... So should I be brave and point people towards Folwren instead of just talking about it, or go with somebody else - probably Nerwen... __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

09-15-2010, 05:29 PM	#6
the phantom Beloved Shadow Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Stadium Posts: 5,971	Shasta- you don't have to have 100% proof of that statement to understand that the point is a nice support for my overall argument. The fact is, what they decided to do had just as much chance of yielding positive results as whatever they would've attempted later in the day, and from my unique perspective I can see quite clearly that they at the least elected an orc. What else do you want me to say? __________________ the phantom has posted. This thread is now important.

09-15-2010, 05:40 PM	#8
Shastanis Althreduin Werewolf Psychic Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water. Posts: 2,832	++Izzy __________________ Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV

09-15-2010, 05:58 PM	#10
the phantom Beloved Shadow Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Stadium Posts: 5,971	Ah, well, you seem to have given part of my answer for me, Shasta. Since I did in fact promise protection to them, I do feel honor bound to give it this day. But the biggest reason for my defense is simply the number of people who thought it very telling. I mean, it's the sort of thing that logically is easy to wave off given the reasoning I have provided, and yet people have remained firm even after I've pointed out these things I never imagined I'd have to bother with. Really, in a typical village I'd expect there to be far more people than me saying, "Bah, it's Day 1. It's a blind shot anyway, so why not go unconventional just this once?" Given past games and behaviors I would have expected a village to have a mix of reactions from "That's annoying!" to "What the heck?" to "Oh well, just being silly". I've been doing this long enough that I can see reactions come ahead of time quite often, and I can tell you the reactions to Sally and Lottie have surprised me, and makes me suspect something or other is off. __________________ the phantom has posted. This thread is now important.

09-15-2010, 06:01 PM	#11
the phantom Beloved Shadow Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Stadium Posts: 5,971	Got to run off now. I'd better go ahead and vote. ++Celuien for rep Because she acts like an orc, and I'd like to see her active in the second part of the day. __________________ the phantom has posted. This thread is now important.

09-15-2010, 05:44 PM	#12
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Okay, I really cannot think anymore, and since nobody seems to help me with the particular concern I have now, I will go to sleep now. And since Izzy already got the vote too, then it is clearly of my other options, ++Nerwen for rep Good night. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories