Okay, so what do you think NOW? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Thinlómien · 09-15-2010, 08:54 AM

I watched the extended editions all in a row on Saturday and I was left feeling quite empty...

I was bored ("oh, it's this scene, I'll go make some tea for us" or "how many minutes will this battle scene still last?").

And kind of sad someone like PJ made the films. It almost made me cry how he and his team have no eye for nuances at all, everything has to be big and blasting, either good or evil, and every single thing has to be explained to the viewer as if to a stupid kid. On the other hand it made me realise that however much Tolkien has been accused of writing black and white fantasy he has an amazing amount of nuances in his work (unlike some others!)

And then, I have to say I admired the film makers' eye for dramatic scenes. You can't really be cynical in the end of the Two Towers when the Rohirrim ride out in one last desperate attempt and Gandalf and Éomer appear.

But then again, Tolkien did that before them and even more impressively. When I last read LotR in July I cried my eyes out at the Pelennor fields.

PS. This thread is about the same topic: A Sad Experience. I quite agree what I said there 1,5 years ago.

TheGreatElvenWarrior · 09-15-2010, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

I was bored ("oh, it's this scene, I'll go make some tea for us" or "how many minutes will this battle scene still last?").

This is what usually happens when I watch them. All of those films get considerably shorter than they were to begin with because I only watch the bits that I really like and those that are more faithful to Tolkien than others. I completely skip over the big battle scenes because they just aren't as exciting as they used to be. Peter Jackson effectively turned some very deep books into action films. Thanks PJ.

Snowdog · 09-15-2010, 06:11 PM

Though I liked the films when they were released, and had fun at line parties and Trilogy Tuesday, subsequent watching burned me out on them. I went to see Fellowship about 8 times, and Two Towers 5 times, but Return of the King twice. Likewise, I watched the extended DVDs only a few times, with me usually falling asleep during them. They now collect dust on the DVD shelf.

Sadly, the movies burned me out on reading the books for a long time. I did read the books once in 2004 to clear my head of PJ's imagery and re-establish my own that I created in my head from the time I first read Lord of the Rings in 1975. Fortunately, most of my visions remained unscathed, and were even enhanced in the case of Boromir and maybe Gollum. I struggled a bit to clear my head of Cate as Galadriel, but did thanks to a good friend of mine who dressed herself as Galadriel and sent me a photo. I read it again this year and all was back to the way it should be.

I have to say that the movies were what they were, and are what they are, and I really have no desire to watch them again, like so many other movies. If I'm going to watch an old movie, it will be Cross of Iron or Kelly's Heroes or Holy Grail or Casablanca.... not the Lord of the Rings. About the most I watch of them anymore is when they are on broadcast TV and I tune in for a bit while some other show is running a commercial.

Ibrîniðilpathânezel · 09-16-2010, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowdog

Though I liked the films when they were released, and had fun at line parties and Trilogy Tuesday, subsequent watching burned me out on them. I went to see Fellowship about 8 times, and Two Towers 5 times, but Return of the King twice. Likewise, I watched the extended DVDs only a few times, with me usually falling asleep during them. They now collect dust on the DVD shelf.

This sounds painfully familiar, though I eschewed Trilogy Tuesday and have thrown out some of the DVDs. What collects dust on my shelf is an unopened, still in the wrapper CD of the RotK soundtrack. My original reactions to the films were clearly trackable by the number of times I was willing to spend money to see them, which if I'm remembering right was about the same as Snowdog's. I was willing to overlook most of the flaws in Jackson's FotR at first because that was the film that stuck most closely to the spirit of the books — and I was holding to the hope that, since there was time, things might get better (like, maybe he would give us a good reason for why he felt Aragorn needed to be a spineless ne'er-do-well). They didn't, and with my hope went my respect for the whole thing. It looked good, sometimes it sounded good, but Jackson increasingly showed that the heart he had designed for it was one of cold cash. A lot of RotK plain didn't make sense from any other standpoint. He'd tossed out Tolkien's books by that point and was winging it to appeal to the commercial audiences that would ring up profits and awards. My interest in the films deteriorated so quickly after those initial viewings, I sat in a TORn chartroom on Oscar night actively rooting for RotK to lose. Didn't do any good, alas. This as well as my editorials on the subject indicate my feelings on the matter.

Now, when I see the films in the TV listings, I might look in to see where they are, but only if it's either FotR or in the early parts of TTT (or close to the very end. I like the looks of the "cavalry comes at dawn" scene). I ignore RotK completely. I never listen to the soundtracks anymore. But my love for the books has never waned. In fact, if it hadn't been for the films, I might never have plowed through a couple of the HoME books. Shows how desperate I was for the Real Thing to wash the gunk of Jackson out of my brain. I wistfully wish that someone would do a decent remake, but I fear it won't happen in my lifetime.

Ah, well.

skip spence · 09-16-2010, 02:22 PM

Don't believe I think any differently about the movies now than I did back then. When FotR came out I went to see it twice in the theatres and loved it. Just the other day I watched the first half of the EE again curled up with some hot tea and a blanket nursing a cold. The novelty's gone now but I enjoyed it (especially the first part in the Shire) although I didn't have the patience to sit it through this time. But I never really watch films repeatedly anyway, hardly even once these days. However, I still think PJ did an excellent job with the first film. It was much, much better than what I had expected beforehand.

I liked TTT also, but to a lesser degree. I don't really have anything principally against the plot changes that were made and for me they often made the experience of watching the films for the first time more enjoyable because with them there was a sense of not knowing what's next, something that would be missing if the films were completely faithful to the books. Some changes did make me cringe, others were rather enjoyable. Examples of things I didn't mind are the Elves at Helm's deep, Arwens extended role, Pip and Merry and even Gimli as comical side-kicks... (though some Gimi-jokes were horrible, granted...)

By the time RotK came out the novelty of Lord Of the Rings-films had worn out for me and I didn't even bother to go and watch it in the theatres. Didn't like the looks of it in trailers and to be honest, I don't think I've watched it in its entirety even once, although I have seen all of the the movie-version in different sittings. And I didn't care much for it. Too loud and stupid and obvious.

Another reason I liked the first film best and the last film worst could be that my preference with the books is the same. I have read FotR more then ten times surely and always enjoy it immensely. RotK maybe only three times and with less enjoyment (though I do like it). TTT maybe five or six times and I adore some chapters in this one but care less for others.

alatar · 09-21-2010, 09:21 AM

LotR is like that friend* of convenience that is no longer convenient. You know, that friendship that came about because you and the other person cohabited a particular time-space moment. You were in the same class at school, and when the semester ended, so did the relationship. You worked together in the same office, played on the same sports team, etc.

It was the circumstances that held you together; when it dissolved, so did the bond.

That's how I can best explain my feelings towards LotR.

*Note that I use the word 'friend' loosely here. My personal definition of the word friend is one who, upon receiving your Red Arrow, jumps on his/her horse and starts riding to your aid at that very moment.

***Mister Underhill*** · 09-21-2010, 09:46 AM

Do you think it has anything to do with having gone over them with a fine-tooth comb for the SbS and beyond? You know, like maybe over-familiarity breeds contempt?

I haven't watched the films in a long time either. I used to be a big re-watcher of movies, but lately when I have precious movie time (i.e., no babbling little hobbit about), I find that I usually crave something that I haven't seen yet.

09-15-2010, 08:54 AM	#1
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	I watched the extended editions all in a row on Saturday and I was left feeling quite empty... I was bored ("oh, it's this scene, I'll go make some tea for us" or "how many minutes will this battle scene still last?"). And kind of sad someone like PJ made the films. It almost made me cry how he and his team have no eye for nuances at all, everything has to be big and blasting, either good or evil, and every single thing has to be explained to the viewer as if to a stupid kid. On the other hand it made me realise that however much Tolkien has been accused of writing black and white fantasy he has an amazing amount of nuances in his work (unlike some others!) And then, I have to say I admired the film makers' eye for dramatic scenes. You can't really be cynical in the end of the Two Towers when the Rohirrim ride out in one last desperate attempt and Gandalf and Éomer appear. But then again, Tolkien did that before them and even more impressively. When I last read LotR in July I cried my eyes out at the Pelennor fields. PS. This thread is about the same topic: A Sad Experience. I quite agree what I said there 1,5 years ago. __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-16-2010, 02:22 PM	#5
skip spence shadow of a doubt Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Back on the streets Posts: 1,125	Don't believe I think any differently about the movies now than I did back then. When FotR came out I went to see it twice in the theatres and loved it. Just the other day I watched the first half of the EE again curled up with some hot tea and a blanket nursing a cold. The novelty's gone now but I enjoyed it (especially the first part in the Shire) although I didn't have the patience to sit it through this time. But I never really watch films repeatedly anyway, hardly even once these days. However, I still think PJ did an excellent job with the first film. It was much, much better than what I had expected beforehand. I liked TTT also, but to a lesser degree. I don't really have anything principally against the plot changes that were made and for me they often made the experience of watching the films for the first time more enjoyable because with them there was a sense of not knowing what's next, something that would be missing if the films were completely faithful to the books. Some changes did make me cringe, others were rather enjoyable. Examples of things I didn't mind are the Elves at Helm's deep, Arwens extended role, Pip and Merry and even Gimli as comical side-kicks... (though some Gimi-jokes were horrible, granted...) By the time RotK came out the novelty of Lord Of the Rings-films had worn out for me and I didn't even bother to go and watch it in the theatres. Didn't like the looks of it in trailers and to be honest, I don't think I've watched it in its entirety even once, although I have seen all of the the movie-version in different sittings. And I didn't care much for it. Too loud and stupid and obvious. Another reason I liked the first film best and the last film worst could be that my preference with the books is the same. I have read FotR more then ten times surely and always enjoy it immensely. RotK maybe only three times and with less enjoyment (though I do like it). TTT maybe five or six times and I adore some chapters in this one but care less for others. __________________ "You can always come back, but you can't come back all the way" ~ Bob Dylan Last edited by skip spence; 09-16-2010 at 02:27 PM.

09-21-2010, 09:21 AM	#6
alatar Doubting Dwimmerlaik Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Heaven's basement Posts: 2,466	LotR is like that friend* of convenience that is no longer convenient. You know, that friendship that came about because you and the other person cohabited a particular time-space moment. You were in the same class at school, and when the semester ended, so did the relationship. You worked together in the same office, played on the same sports team, etc. It was the circumstances that held you together; when it dissolved, so did the bond. That's how I can best explain my feelings towards LotR. Note that I use the word 'friend' loosely here. My personal definition of the word friend* is one who, upon receiving your Red Arrow, jumps on his/her horse and starts riding to your aid at that very moment. __________________ There is naught that you can do, other than to resist, with hope or without it.

09-15-2010, 06:11 PM	#3
Snowdog Emperor of the South Pole Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: The Western Shore of Lake Evendim Posts: 667	Though I liked the films when they were released, and had fun at line parties and Trilogy Tuesday, subsequent watching burned me out on them. I went to see Fellowship about 8 times, and Two Towers 5 times, but Return of the King twice. Likewise, I watched the extended DVDs only a few times, with me usually falling asleep during them. They now collect dust on the DVD shelf. Sadly, the movies burned me out on reading the books for a long time. I did read the books once in 2004 to clear my head of PJ's imagery and re-establish my own that I created in my head from the time I first read Lord of the Rings in 1975. Fortunately, most of my visions remained unscathed, and were even enhanced in the case of Boromir and maybe Gollum. I struggled a bit to clear my head of Cate as Galadriel, but did thanks to a good friend of mine who dressed herself as Galadriel and sent me a photo. I read it again this year and all was back to the way it should be. I have to say that the movies were what they were, and are what they are, and I really have no desire to watch them again, like so many other movies. If I'm going to watch an old movie, it will be Cross of Iron or Kelly's Heroes or Holy Grail or Casablanca.... not the Lord of the Rings. About the most I watch of them anymore is when they are on broadcast TV and I tune in for a bit while some other show is running a commercial.

09-21-2010, 09:46 AM	#7
*Mister Underhill* Dread Horseman Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Behind you! Posts: 2,744	Do you think it has anything to do with having gone over them with a fine-tooth comb for the SbS and beyond? You know, like maybe over-familiarity breeds contempt? I haven't watched the films in a long time either. I used to be a big re-watcher of movies, but lately when I have precious movie time (i.e., no babbling little hobbit about), I find that I usually crave something that I haven't seen yet.