Orcrist's owner

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Hmmm... you know what, Elrond only says that both swords were made in Gondolin, not that both were owned by Gondolindrim lords. Could Orcrist have been Fingon's?

I wouldn't think Fingon was the owner. He never set foot in Gondolin, and only met Turgon and the Gondolindrim in the Nirnaeth. Also, he died in that battle, and whatever sword had been in his possession surely would have been buried in the Hill of Slain with his body and never recovered.

I rather like the idea of Ecthelion being the owner of Orcrist, and the sword being saved from the sack of the City, but I can't find any textual basis for it.

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I wouldn't think Fingon was the owner. He never set foot in Gondolin, and only met Turgon and the Gondolindrim in the Nirnaeth. Also, he died in that battle, and whatever sword had been in his possession surely would have been buried in the Hill of Slain with his body and never recovered.

Well, my guess was based on Rumil's idea that the two swords seemed to be a pair, so I thought Turgon could have had it made as a gift to his brother. Didn't they really meet at all in the centuries between the founding of Gondolin and the Nirnaeth? Now I think of it, suppose not... Elvish family relations are strange to us mortals. And yeah, I probably should re-read the Silmarillion one of these days.

What other close kinsmen did Turgon have? Maeglin, of course - though I'd imagine he brought his own sword from Eöl's smithy.

Anyway, Orcrist clearly was a renowned blade, so if the owner wasn't kin to Turgon, I'd at least suppose him to be one of the more illustrious chieftains of Gondolin. Ecthelion would be as good a bet as any in that case. (Not Glorfindel, I think - Elrond would have mentioned it if the sword had belonged to a member of his household.*)

*(compulsory meta-remark: this fails to take into account that Tolkien most likely had no idea of a reincarnated Glorfindel's presence in Rivendell when he wrote TH, but never mind.)

[Rumil]

Evening all,

the 'pair' concept was suggested to me by the goblins calling the swords 'Biter and Beater'. And if we go for 'Gondolinites', there are some more to rule out perhaps-

Duilin - bow
Galdor - club
Rog - mace
Salgant - unlikely! not really very renowned....

So we still have Ecthelion, Glorfindel and Penlod, and possibly Duilin as he probably had a sword as well as a bow. Another intriguing possibility is Pengolodh the loremaster, who did escape Gondolin (and might be a version of Penlod?).

I'm going with everyone else and putting my money on Ecthelion!

Oh, hang on, Tuor used the axe Dramborleg indeed, but Turgon left shield, hauberk, sword and helm for Tuor in Vinyamar. So could be Tuor's? Perhaps Turgon, having being instructed by Ulmo, left the very best gear there, as a mark of respect to the command of the Valar.

On the other hand, were Orcrist and Glamdring 'from' Gondolin or 'forged in' Gondolin? If the second, I guess its still just possible that they were made while Turgon's folk were in the process of moving in from Vinyamar.