WW LXXV: It's Always Tea Time Here

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Loslote

Anywho, Boro agreed most fervently about Greenie and Sally. He was not as enthusiastic about Agan and Glirdy, but he did agree that it was likely they were wolfly. He trusted Nienna and Mira most out of everyone who was him or me. Just in case you were wondering.

out of everyone who was not him or you, you wanted to say, I assume. Anyway... in contrary to people wondering about Lottie's suspects, I suggest we really consider them strongly (especially those which they agreed on). Of course, they are subjectively biased by the fact that it's two Shiriffs who have something in common who are making them, but the fact that two innocent people can communicate and agree on somebody is worth taking into account. Of course a bunch of innocents can be misled by pursuing the same illusion (and it happens all the time), but still - two brains know more than one. How many PMs did you guys exchange, Lottie? Especially the last Night? (Not sure if you are any longer around, but anyway, I think this might be a good thing to say anyway, as for us to take into account in the future - the more you've been able to put together the better.) For that matter, did you or Boro have any fears as to that you might be targeted at Night? (Like that Boro's apology to Fea in the last minute... when I saw it, it seemed like rather an unfortunate thing to say.)

Originally Posted by Aganzir

I don't think the connection was that obvious either. While skimming through the thread in the night I noticed there might be something between them, but I didn't actually think they were the Shirriffs. However it's likely that the wolves spend more time looking for possible connections than the innocents. But on the other hand, Lottie might have been a relatively easy lynch today... So I don't really know.

Curious. As I haven't been skimming through the thread much, but I haven't noticed any connection between them, however, thinking about Lottie (wondering whether she is a Wolf or not), I remembered that "I am not evil" saying of her, and came to the conclusion that if I were to believe her, then it basically screams Shiriff, as they are the ones who are not allowed to reveal - so that's as most as she could have said. But maybe your brain is just not as clever as mine or then you are intentionally misleading us (rather clumsily, though) in trying to say that you weren't part of any Night planning.

That said, whereas Agan is starting to slightly annoy me again, I still want to keep myself in check and I don't think she is a Wolf, actually. Not this time. And at least I would hope I am right.

[Nerwen]

I'd like to comment on the several people toDay who are expressing surprise or confusion where I just don't think it's warranted.

Nienna at #226 "has stopped having any sort of idea what is going on". (May be just be referring to Sally's Game reference, however).

Sally at #229 wants to know:

what the heck happened at the end of the Day yesterDay? Don't get me wrong, yay dead cobbler, but a dead cobbler is not a dead wolf. Sally demands an....an expla.....explanat....some country.....

(Hmmn. Possible hint of wolfish chagrin there?)

Sally, really, what do you mean, "what the heck happened?"

Lommy at #235 is surprised that Fea was the cobbler and had seen no connection between Lottie and Boro.

Agan at #247 agrees with her on both points.

Me too but I'm happy she was lynched in the end. That's what happens when you think you know better what Fea is doing...
(...)
I don't think the connection was that obvious either. While skimming through the thread in the night I noticed there might be something between them, but I didn't actually think they were the Shirriffs

Now, firstly, I just can't see why it's so surprising that someone who acted in a typically cobbleresque manner turned out to be, in fact, the cobbler. I know Lommy said she thought Lottie might be the cobbler yesterDay, and it was something that crossed my mind in the early part of the Day– but Fea should have been, it seems to me, a clear runner-up at least.

Secondly– I may of course be developing Nogroditis– but I'm surprised anyone didn't see a possible connection between Boro and Lottie after the end of yesterDay– and having seen it, the idea that they might be the Shirriffs is a logical next step. I mean, it wasn't the only thing that occurred to me– but to say you never noticed, or even more, that you did, but never thought of them being the Shirriffs seems a little disingenuous.

EIDT:X'd since Legate.
EDIT2: word left out.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

a question: am I reading a totally different game than you others?! for what I've seen, there was the joke Fea vote which seemed like an obvious to be retracted vote, my and Greenie's votes, Sally's suspicion and Agan's suspicion and vote for someone else than Lottie... ..what? should we start suspecting Sally now? she's the only one whose approach could be called "smooth" or sneaky...

Not sure if I understand what you mean by this... but if you mean what I think you mean, at least for me it was slightly unnerving - influenced by the worries stated by Nogrod - to see the number of Lottie-voters amassing. That's what I'd call "smooth": going on and on, nobody seemed to contest it (at least by that time). Well anyway I think I elaborated on that yesterDay back then.


Now after Lommy's post it made me once again doubt Zil's innocence, returning my somehow bad feeling about him from early yesterDay. For now thinking of it, his action in relation to the Loslote-wagon would seem like a very nice "I-am-a-Wolf, I'll start out of the way but oh look, what those evil people are doing! On the other hand, if you decide all that Lottie is guilty, fine by me, do it, I just want you to lynch somebody else than us Wolves".

Originally Posted by skip spence

G'day folks and gentlehobbits...

Skimmed the thread just now and I'm wondering, why is Lottie now though of as a known innocent? Is that based only on Boro's last moment vote retraction?

Most of all, she revealed herself as Shiriff. Unless there appears another Shiriff claiming otherwise, I trust her. And since nobody did...

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Now, firstly, I just can't see why it's so surprising that someone who acted in a typically cobbleresque manner turned out to be, in fact, the cobbler. I know Lommy said she thought Lottie might be the cobbler yesterDay, and it was something that crossed my mind in the early part of the Day– but Fea should have been, it seems to me, a clear runner-up at least.

Secondly– I may of course be developing Nogroditis– but I'm surprised anyone didn't see a possible connection Boro and Lottie after the end of yesterDay– and having seen it, the idea that they might be the Shirriffs is a logical next step. I mean, it wasn't the only thing that occurred to me– but to say you never noticed, or even more, that you did, but never thought of them being the Shirriffs seems a little disingenuous.

Just a note here, as I think there is at least one part of it which I can see an explanation for from first-hand experience: even though I'd assume that people who have read the thread and thought about it would come to the conclusions above, it's not necessary that they have read it or came to the conclusions. For instance myself, after I have voted, I went to sleep - and later at Night only checked the outcome and did not much bother myself about who voted whom up to this morning, thus, not thinking about Boro at all (but yes about Loslote, as it was a thing I have been thinking about: so she's not lynched, but that does not mean she's innocent, but have I been wrong? So what did she say? But hey, what was this "I'm not evil!" shouting from her - and *click*, here came the idea). As for Fea, I have not seen her posting anything Cobbler-ish, unless you count the vote (for which there was other explanation offered by Lommy), by the time I went to sleep, there was like one more post from her saying nothing at all, and once again, when I read the rest of the thread, she was already dead and her role revealed. That's just to say that at least when it comes to us Europeans, I could see this as one possible thing happening that somebody might not have read the after-we-went-to-sleep things early or with much care, so I'd be taking it into account. On the other hand, if somebody claims to have read them and they have not spotted anything, that maybe might be somewhat puzzling. But otherwise, well.

EDIT: x-ed with one Nerwen, Lommy and skip

[Thinlómien]

Can I offer a timezoney explanation for somethings?

A bunch of votes for Loslote emerged quite quick because the people who had suspected her happened to be mostly European and had to go to sleep. There was no competing wagon emerging around the same time for obvious reasons: why would any American (or Nogrod ) vote when there was still several hours until the deadline which is evening their time?

And to rephrase Legate, there is also nothing weird in anyone who went to sleep when only 1/3 of the discussion had taken place being surprised by the recent outcomes. I read the Day when I woke up, but I did it only quickly, knowing that if I'm still alive the next Day, I have to reread it anyway because I want to talk about it. That way it was easy to miss significant stuff between Boro and Lottie (and btw while I can admit you can see there's something, I wouldn't definitely call it obvious even now).

Also, when I went to sleep I was certain Fea would come back later and post more sense, as she usually does, so I had no reason to believe her a cobbler, especially as I had a believable excuse for her vote in my head. (And mind you, even though she was a cobbler, it doesn't mean I was wrong about her vote. )

I also wanted to say something NOT related to timezones, but I forgot it...