For in that sleep of death what dreams may come.

[davem]

Originally Posted by alatar

The only issue I have with eternal nows and experiencing the past, present and future is that seems to make the future pre-determined. If I were that 16th century guy and had a 21st century experience, that would mean that what we do today has already been done and recorded.
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Ok - slightly different angle ... surely, from a theistic pov (& admittedly I'm only a 'cultural', as opposed to a 'practicing', Christian, so I may be a bit out on this) God's perspective is kind of equivalent to this 'observer 2' in that He sees the whole of creation at once, past, present & future (as we would label them), & hence from His perspective today has "already been done & recorded". Thus, such an experience (assuming He permitted it, or gifted it) would be possible for an individual. In fact, one could argue that this is evidence for a direct intervention of Eru in Middle-earth as only he could gift this experience - for instance as a way of comforting & inspiring Frodo in his dream.

Certainly it doesn't at all imply that the future is 'pre-determined' - unless you're arguing that observer 1's journey down the river is 'pre-determined' because the river already exists & 'observer 2' can see what is around the next bend before 'observer 1' does. 'Observer 2' knows what 'observer 1' is going to see simply because he has a different perspective. That doesn't invalidate 'observer 1's' experience, or mean that he has no freedom of choice, or turn him into some kind of robot. If God knows what I will do as completely as He knows what I have done (which He must do if he is omniscient) does that mean that I am not free to do what I want, & am therefore not responsible for my actions, & never have been - or does it simply mean that he, being transcendent, can see 'past, present & future' as an eternal 'Now'.