WW LX - Mortal Men, doomed to die

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Oh, wilwa, sorry if we played together and I did not remember: but if it was in some of the recent games, it was probably so that I died sometime on Day 1, so I hope you can excuse me that I don't remember much interaction with you

haha, no worries, to be honest the yesterDay I wasn't sure whether we had played together and had to go back and see, and it turns out we were both in Sally's game. Just thought it was funny that both of us had chosen to forget that game.

Anyway, down to business, some thoughts I meant to put down about half an hour ago before I was interrupted by the phone:

Originally Posted by Eomer of the Rohirrim

Now, don't jump on me for saying this, but the only way the Wraiths think she was the Seer is because she listed everyone and said that she has a good feeling about precisely one of them: and that's Eomer. I don't consider her bad feeling about Shasta to indicate Seer-dom because it was a straight-forward vote-based criticism that anyone could have made.

Now, I always think of finding the Seer first so those are my first thoughts. It could just be that she leaves no trail whatsoever, but I'm never sure Wraiths would kill like that.

Uhm, I disagree with you, and agree with Legate. Saying she's "keen" on you and then joking you're probably a wolf is not a good Kath-seer hint, she would have been far sneekier about any seer hints, and atleast one, if not more, of the wraiths would have known that about her.

I believe Kath was simply killed for being a safe kill. I'm very sure that Wraiths would kill like that, it's a totally logical way to go, they don't want to leave a trail, I know I've done it in past games as a baddie.

So basically, I don't think there's much info to get out of her posts. We should probably focus on the living, not the dead. Until maybe a few more Nights have passed, perhaps a pattern may arise from the Night choices and then Kath's death can be reconsidered then. But now, I believe it's not worth the time.

So anyway, here are my basic thoughts at this time about everyone:

Nienna: Her first post about waiting til there's more discussion is odd, but I can somewhat relate to that. I'm terrible at Day 1 banter and therefore participate very little, Nienna is probably like that aswell. I'm going to wait to see more of her before trying to form any sort of opinion. By Day 2, I'm sure she's bound to have more to say, if not then suspicion is possible for her.

Kent: I don't know, only a few posts, not much to go on, I believe this is his first game (correct me if I'm wrong), I'm gonna wait on him aswell, but I have to admit I was getting a negative vibe.

Legate: As I was reading through his posts from yesterDay at first I didn't like him too much, but now more and more I'm starting to feel good about him. I can honestly say I'm very glad the coin-toss didn't result in me voting him. Actually back in my post about yesterDays posting I think I may have put something in there meant for someone else, about a post on #65/66, will have to go back and check on that.

Nogrod: Well, he is Nogrod. I don't know, he is indeed aggressive, but I don't see that as really being anything new. So I'm iffy right now.

Shasta: Not at all much to go one. So nothing.

Nerwen: Doesn't like us sorcerors . I don't believe she voted, which I don't like, I think people are better voting early if they think there is a chance they won't be here on time, but seem to remember this being a usual Nerwen thing, though she was a baddie last time I played with her and she did this, so I don't really know. I'm keeping my eyes on her.

Nilp: is Nilp. For now, there's nothing else.

Rune: An old friend, haven't played with him in ages, and really can't remember his usual style, so nothing really to compare to. Though is very defensive, not only of himself but he is quick to defend others, which I don't actually see as totally bad, especially cause he defended me slightly yesterDay. But still.....yeah, not sure, but definitely not loving right now.

Lhuna: Consistent, which is good, stuck to Legate from the beginning, not really getting any overly negative vibes for now.

Eomer: Hmmm, yeah, not liking this at all. One thing that stands out from the notes I took earlier is that he seems to be leaning towards voting Nog for a while, but then later votes Izzy to save Nog, I'll go back and read the wording again exactly, but from that little bit I don't like it. And his post I commented on earlier doesn't sit well with me either. Later on toDay (after sleep, and re-reading, and discussion and such), I'll have a stronger opinion, but right now I'm leading towards guilty.

Groin: still nothing, at all, unless I missed him in there somewhere. He is still playing right??

Sally: Not a lot. So nothing yet.

Eönwë: Some random stuff, quite obsessed with that greek letter, haha. Not liking, but not strongly enough to vote for, atleast so far toDay.

Brinniel: Had a similar Day 1 to me yesterDay, so I'm OK with her so far, I'll wait and see til there's more.

Alright, so that's it from me for atleast a couple hours. I think I should probably be able to come back on in the next 3 hours or so before sleeping, always a chance that could change though, but I'll try my hardest. Tomorrow is suddenly full for me, but I'll hopefully be on randomly, and my vote will probably be far closer to the deadline. I'll try my best to be on as much as I can.

[Kent2010]

Kent: I don't know, only a few posts, not much to go on,
-wilwarin

Not to call you a hypocrit, and granted I am not lighting this ship on fire with many posts, but in this boat I am in the top half of posters and have more than you. And the phantom's last game was my first.

So now onto Nogrod. Out of all the fire and vigor he showed at the beginning, I was quite disappointed with his end performance, and that is why I am flipping my original opinion on him. When it came to the deadline, Nogrod fizzled out, or maybe he would say played more relax.

Your past deadline vote for sally looks bad I do not imagine you to be someone who likes to miss voting. There was a general confusion towards the end, but there is no indication you cross-posted with anyone (including Eonwe's vote before yours) - did you?

And as far as someone looking relaxed it did not seem like you minded whether it was Izzy or sally. In posts 102 and 109 you quote Izzy and say a couple words that looks like it's nudging suspicion towards her way.

Of those who have garnered votes this far I'd be most happy to vote for Sally basically for bandwaggoning an innocent.
-post 93

This is interesting, and this is what I was going to be suspicious of Kath for today, but that is moot now. Anyway, the over-reaction to the two votes against you worries me. First, I would not classify two early votes as a bandwagon - what happened to Izzy yesterday was a bandwagon. And secondly who determined you are innocent?

Okay. At the moment I'm inclined to vote either Groin or Eönwë. But they have an hour to change that inclination.
-post 73

Why didn't you go for Groin then? And why have you not pursued after him today?

[wilwarin538]

Not to call you a hypocrit, and granted I am not lighting this ship on fire with many posts, but in this boat I am in the top half of posters and have more than you. And the phantom's last game was my first.

I'll re-word then: yesterDay there were 6 posts by you, and the first 2 were random in-character Day 1 stuff (which I have no problem with), so 4 posts (even though that's more then my own count) is not enough for me to have a strong enough opinion; only a feeling, which is definitely subject to change and shouldn't cause you any worry for now since there are others that I'm far more unsure of. And I didn't follow phantom's game, I hadn't realised you had been in it, sorry for calling you a noobie.

So only 1 post since mine, I don't really have much more to add. I'm off to bed, hopefully I can make it on quickly in the morning, but the rest of my participation toDay will probably be in the last few hours leading up to the deadline.

[Nienna]

I've been trying to keep up but I really haven't had much time to read. I'll be around tomorrow more for a few hours before deadline when I will give more input.

And Sally is still making me nervous.

[Brinniel]

Poor Kath does seem to get eaten a lot early in the game, doesn't she? Probably because she's so quiet and untraceable.

Hmm...I'm still trying to wrap my head around everything; I feel so behind. Strangely, none of the votes towards the end of yesterDay bother me. Usually at least one initially sticks out as particularly bad, but not this time. But surely there's gotta be at least one rotten apple among the end-of-Day voters. That's how it usually ends up.

I need to take a look at the earlier voters too and see if anything sticks out from them. My suspects? Uhhh... The only one who currently worries me is Eomer, and that is all based off gut feeling. I obviously need to give more thought and research to this. I will try to contribute something more before I go to bed, but I am awfully tired and lacking in sleep, so we'll see.

Sorry, as I still won't be able to give outstanding participation toDay, but at least I certainly should be able to do more than yesterDay. For one thing, it looks like I'll have time to post some and then vote tomorrow, which is nice since I really hate voting at night when the thread is dead. And no more randomness, promise. I know you all hate it, and I'd rather be helpful, even if my time is limited.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Interesting how many people bit at that.

"No! No! It can't possibly be a Seer hint! It had to be because Kath left no trail!"

Why so jumpy? I even asked you not to jump at me?

Look at Kath's list. She is neutral about everyone; except she says she is "keen" on Eomer and "not keen" on Shasta. Now, where I come from, "keen" can be significant.

I'm not going to press the point any further, as I'm very far from convinced myself. It's just funny how three (I think) people have jumped on this rejecting it immediately, not even entertaining the notion. This whole decision of leaving Kath-discussion down to "IT WAS A SAFE KILL - THE END" strikes me as lazy.

Back with more later, hopefully, depends how busy work is.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Eomer of the Rohirrim

Look at Kath's list. She is neutral about everyone; except she says she is "keen" on Eomer and "not keen" on Shasta. Now, where I come from, "keen" can be significant.

I'm not going to press the point any further, as I'm very far from convinced myself. It's just funny how three (I think) people have jumped on this rejecting it immediately, not even entertaining the notion. This whole decision of leaving Kath-discussion down to "IT WAS A SAFE KILL - THE END" strikes me as lazy.

Yes, but to be fair, people might be afraid that you're a wraith taking advantage of the situation to make yourself look innocent. After all, whether they killed her for looking Seerish or not, the fact is that her death doesn't obviously point to anyone, so why would the guilty parties not want it discussed? (Unless there's something in her posts that the innocents haven't noticed.)

But the other question is– why a no-trace kill, if that's indeed what it was? There was plenty of suspicion being thrown around last Night– did no-one manage to suspect a wraith? Or did they, and the wraiths were too afraid of striking the Hunter? Were there no opportunities for them to frame someone else?

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Forgive me for my rather brief appearance yesterday (and the attendant fit of madness), but I have just spent the rest of that DAY in the palace of Númenor, attempting to establish an embassy between their island and the land of my origin. Alas that a proper fear of outsiders is not limited to a few men.

However I am glad to return toDAY to this most interesting colloquy . . . A lot of you have forwarded ideas about the death of poor dear Kath the previous NIGHT, and somehow I am relieved that some of us here are thinking--and speaking their thoughts. An exchange of information among people of thought has been one of the paths to enlightenment.

Now I shall wander a bit around the court, listening to conversations I might have missed. *opens fan, covers lower half of the face*

[Eönwë]

Originally Posted by Eomer of the Rohirrim

Interesting how many people bit at that.

"No! No! It can't possibly be a Seer hint! It had to be because Kath left no trail!"

Why so jumpy? I even asked you not to jump at me?

Look at Kath's list. She is neutral about everyone; except she says she is "keen" on Eomer and "not keen" on Shasta. Now, where I come from, "keen" can be significant.

I'm not going to press the point any further, as I'm very far from convinced myself. It's just funny how three (I think) people have jumped on this rejecting it immediately, not even entertaining the notion. This whole decision of leaving Kath-discussion down to "IT WAS A SAFE KILL - THE END" strikes me as lazy.

First of all, I agree with you that it's not good just to leave it as an "it was a safe kill - the end", but there really isn't that much she said that we have much to go on.
What I don't like, however is the the way that you are being jumpy by immediately labelling people who disagree with your comments as being jumpy. And don't they have a right to disagree with you? Especially when the way you put your ideas makes it seem obvious that you are innocent.
You speak reason, but I don't like your methods.

[Eönwë]

Ok, I'm here, am catching up with what I missed...

Meanwhile:

Originally Posted by wilwa about me

quite obsessed with that greek letter, haha.

One and a half posts = obsessed?

edit: don't know if I x-ed (probably did). haven't caught up yet.