Dueling Wizards Werewolf II discussion thread

[Lhunardawen]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

To address Lhuna's points (hail for the reading effort!)

*curtsies*

I'd say two kills with 4-6 wolves. What to do if the EW manages to scry her wolf-total to 7? Scrying four additional wolves without losing one would take four days in which time they would have in the best case killed 11 innocents. With 25 people playing that would mean the game was over (7 wolves, 2 wizards, 5 innocents) and even with 30 players it would look grim indeed (7 wolves, 2 wizards, 10 innocents). Maybe we should stick to two kills at Night the highest? Although it should be remembered that the EW will not be that efficient in practise and the scenario is a bit far-fetched.

I agree with you and Agan. 2 Night kills, tops, should do.

What's your timezone? GMT+? The American players would like to make it as late as it could be pushed and to me my limit would be 2AM my time eg. 11PM GMT.

GMT +8 for me and Nilp. I'm not sure how a 7 AM deadline will sit with him, but I'm perfectly fine with it.

The question of possible sub-mods needs to be raised again though. I have a vacation and could be reading the thread quite actively so I might also be able to handle the traffic myself - at least for a few days. Roa offered to be a sub-mod and that offer is appreciated. But as she told me in her PM that she could also play I'd love to see her play more than to sub-mod the game...

I think that will be the case with practically anyone - we'd much rather see them play than mod.

Roa! Oooh. That's wonderful. Welcome back. And did I read right that Celuien's sure to be here?

Maybe I could try to persuade someone who drops out of the game early on to join forces with me submodding the game and do the modding alone the first Days / Nights before a submod emerges from the dropped players? That would sound the most sensible to me.

I think that's a good idea.

Retractable votes are fun but I think there are enough twists and turns in this game without them. So I'd say no as well. With double-lynches I'd like to hear more from you people. For it could be also argued that in a big village it would be good to have double-lynches.

Okay, maybe it could be put up to a vote. I'm still siding with no.

This is a point to be decided. In relation to DW I we have already eased the GW's situation by allowing her to scry all three gifteds in the beginning. Also if we give the Evil-side less kills than in the last game I'd say we should not give the GW more than three gifteds at a time. The game needed some balancing but let's not "overbalance" it? I'll try to make some dry-runs to see how it goes with different rules...

Oh, yes, of course. The ordos are still on the good side. Maybe each gift can be re-given only once, and then no more?

I'd say no to both. Making Days or Nights longer would easily lead to confusion and Daytime messaging might be a too powerful weapon to the GW (as it would seem the GW has more sense in sharing the knowledge of the roles with her minions).

Point taken. (Can you tell I (morally) want the Good Team to win so much? )

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

You forgot DST, daga. They have them, we don't. So we're GDT+7 now.

I shall be a house-bound sandwich-maker. (Aprons look better on me than on Lommy, who, I believe, is better suited to aquatic poultry-raising. ) Also, I say 'nay' to multiple lynchings, 'nay' to retractable votes. Retractable votes are a needless complication, and multiple lynchings make the game too mathematical, especially in a game where the Seer could be reactivated.

Up next, a cost-benefit analysis of Nogrod's Three Possibilities, after finishing my synthesis paper for translation class.

[Cailín]

I must agree with Nilp and others: no multiple lynching and no retractable votes. The game is complicated enough without them, and many people will die without giving the village that additional power.

Four wolves or more should allow for two kills a night, while more than six wolves should allow for three (surely we'll not let it get that far?).

I think that by allowing the GW to bless three gifteds from the beginning, you already fix a lot of the balance issues we had last time. The game may even be swayed too much in favour of the good side, so I think a limit on the amount of regiftings is a good idea. Will the Hunter be an ordinary Hunter, by the way?

Have we yet decided on communication (sorry, it was a lot to read)? I remember from last time that the GW had difficulties because there was not enough time to discuss crucial choices with his team members.

[Thinlómien]

I shall be a house-bound sandwich-maker. (Aprons look better on me than on Lommy, who, I believe, is better suited to aquatic poultry-raising.)

Great, Nilp, what a well earning man I've married.... I think I'll be just a bird-tamer in general. So, breeding and training birds, whether they're aquatic or not, although preferring a certain aquatic bird species... Sally (with her duck interest) can be my assistant, Kath may be her father's follower in the sandwich "business"...

Sorry, I can't say anything smart about the rules right now, will do that later...

[A Little Green]

Nilp, dear son-in-law, do you make smørrebrød as well?

Bird-taming sounds honourable enough. I wait to see what my son has chosen for profession...

[Lhunardawen]

Originally Posted by Nilpaurion Felagund

You forgot DST, daga. They have them, we don't. So we're GDT+7 now.

Whoops. I never did get the hang of DST. Thanks, daga.

(To Mordor: ++Daylight Savings Time)

Originally Posted by Nilp

Retractable votes are a needless complication, and multiple lynchings make the game too mathematical, especially in a game where the Seer could be reactivated.

There's the reason I was looking for.

Originally Posted by Cailín

Four wolves or more should allow for two kills a night, while more than six wolves should allow for three (surely we'll not let it get that far?).

I was thinking about this too - maybe it would be added motivation to the innocents to track down the wolves before they became too many?

Originally Posted by Mummy Cailin

Have we yet decided on communication (sorry, it was a lot to read)? I remember from last time that the GW had difficulties because there was not enough time to discuss crucial choices with his team members.

Nogmod said communications are limited to Nights. Oh well...

[Nogrod]

Should we open a hard-core rule-thread so that no one gets frustrated with the need of ironing out the rules?

Celuien sent me a PM saying she will be playing. So that's true and confirmed. Great to see her for a long time!

Bad news is that Boro will only have one day/week time to play in the coming weeks and is forced to stay away from the game.

I'd say in this kind of game the hunter should be of the classical variety eg. posting a name of one person s/he is hunting and that one will die whether innocent or wolf. As the good team has the advance of sharing GW's and seer's pssible knowledge there must be this risk-factor included.

Have we yet decided on communication (sorry, it was a lot to read)? I remember from last time that the GW had difficulties because there was not enough time to discuss crucial choices with his team members.

I stil think 24hour cycle should be enough. If the deadline is 11PM GMT it will be pretty good for all the Europeans and Americans enabling them to check the PM's at various points during the Night - including just before and just after the deadline.

The late deadline might be a bit inconvenient for some Europeans (us Finns and possibly Legate) but that makes it possible for Lhuna and Nilp to be there at the deadline - and eases the situation of the Americans who have day-time occupations. So I think it's a good compromise.

I wouldn't set any internal deadlines to the communication during the Night from outside as they just tend to complicate matters and are hard to define as so much would depend on who the people involved are. The wizards themselves surely are free to impose deadlines to their minions if they see it fit. If the EW calls her wolves and says fex. "if you wish to make points on who to kill, please do it before 6PM GMT as I will not take later contributions into consideration"; or if the GW tells her gifteds that "all the suggestions as to your targets toNight should be with me at 8PM GMT the latest or I will decide it for you" then it's fine for me.

So it's also a question of the wizards telling their minions when they are able to receive information the last time before they send their decisions to me/submod. And in the end active minions can approach their master enough-many times a Night - and an active wizard may give the feedback as well many times a Night. So I wouldn't be too concerned about this question.

[Volo]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

There is. As you can see from the family tree, Greenie's family is all green

Haha! Pity I can't rep you at the moment! This made my otherwise boring evening somewhat merrier, for a reason I can't explain.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Should we open a hard-core rule-thread so that no one gets frustrated with the need of ironing out the rules?

Actually. Now a bad idea. I feel like playing WW already and it's only the discussion thread. It would make things easier. (and we'd break the limit for WW threads for one game )

I think 4-> Wolves=2 kills.

How about the beginning? A situation like Loki's, both Wizards choose the same player before the game even starts. Wouldn't it be unfair if the player died?

Noggie, could I be your father?

edit: and when I was younger my profession was being the guy who knows everything about staying alive.

[Celuien]

Originally Posted by Lhunardawen

And did I read right that Celuien's sure to be here?

'Tis absolutely correct! I couldn't stay away from the Dueling Wizards return... and it has been far too long since I've been in a game.

I'm looking for a family, if there's anyone who doesn't mind being related to a long-lost wandering child like me.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Celuien

I'm looking for a family, if there's anyone who doesn't mind being related to a long-lost wandering child like me.

I would suggest that you would consider being the mother of Legate / Brinn / Kitanna -trio of 20+ children.

If Morm would be your husband we could start to build another big family there (I could be related to either of you then thus bringing Lalaith and Nerwen and their offspring into the same family as well).

Or how about taking the "young guys" Gwath & McCaber under your protective mummy's care? (sorry guys but that's just the impression that comes to my mind first from this particular game setting... - I mean "dudes" quarrelling over girlfriends and the stuff)

I still think we will (have to) get a few players in * so there might be other possibilities as well.

But just suggestions...

Any children in need of a mom?

* The official number of players is now 23. There are three people who have quite lately said they would like to join but have not posted to this particular thread (Valier, Azaelia, The Ka). I also hope to hear still from a few people I've sent an invitation to. But feel free to invite people in! 26-28 would be good (the last game had 30). But there's still about two weeks before we start so I'm quite confident we will have a good number of players.