Werewolf XLII: The meaning of life forever

[Brinniel]

Right now, McCaber is looking most suspicious to me. I didn't like his switch to side with Naria yesterDay, saying he would've voted Roa when he looked like he was going to do the exact opposite. He also said a few comments to Nogrod I thought were odd.

Menel looks pretty fishy to me, and he could quite easily be lying about his role, especially if Legate was gifted. My main worry though is that he could be telling the truth...then what a horrible mistake that would be to lynch him. Valier made a valid point about him, but she has no way to prove her own innocence. If Menel is truthful it doesn't necessarily point to her guilt because Legate could've easily been a wolf too. If a wolf, Valier would know this and could easily be playing us. But I just don't know. I'm split between the two of them...either one of them could just as easily be innocent as they are suspicious. Which is why I'd rather not take the risk of lynching either toDay. There's no room for any error, simple as that.

[Brinniel]

I really don't like rushing this at all and I wish I had more time to think this over...but I have to leave this second and won't be back before the deadline. Therefore, I have to go with the one who looks most wolfish to me:

++McCaber

EDIT: Heh, just realised I quad posted...

[Aganzir]

I think Volo was merely joking about the lover thing. Besides, had Nog and Rikae truly been lovers, why on earth would Rikae have been all for lynching Nog then? Just to frame a gifted Lommy? I don't buy that.

Lommy annoys me (though I'm rather sure her fellow wolves are crying tears of laughter while reading her posts). And I agree with everybody who said that she should be ignored.

But I'm a bit perplexed about this Menel/Valier thing. Well, at least I'm surer than ever now that Legate wasn't a wolf...
If Valier is a wolf, there's no reason to doubt Menel's claim, which in itself looks rather suspicious though. If Menel is a wolf, he was gambling while claiming to be a gifted - he couldn't know if Val was one.
And why did Lommy declare Valier a wolf? Either she's Lommy's fellow and Lommy wants her to look more innocent or Menel's Lommy's fellow and Lommy is triple-bluffing. Ok, I'm not going to dwell on that at the moment.

By the way, if one of you got Nog's role, feel free to tell it even though it was rather clear anyway & Lommy has already provived us with her own version.

Originally Posted by Menel

McCaber, well I do see some wolfishness in his behavior, but I think it would be a little risky to lynch him just yet rather than one of the other two I mentioned.

"1. Let's lynch Lommy who's probably protected!
2. Let's lynch Valier before she has a chance to question my gifted claim!
3. Since Cab is so suspected I think I must say something about him as well... They're going to lynch me if I say he looks innocent so I say I suspect him a little... But my preferences are those suspicious people voting for whom ensures our furry team's victory."

Ms. Joyce, why are you implying that Lommy was protected tonight? So that we could try to lynch her today, find her protected and help the wolves win (I'm speaking about the worst-case scenario, which we should consider to be true in order to avoid a fatal error)?
Ok, I know I might be flushing a gifted out by asking this, but I don't think it really matters anymore. I found your statement (especially repeating that you know she was protected) weird.

Originally Posted by Kath

Pretty keen on lynching Nog though, which does alter my thoughts a bit.

That was only after Nog had said he considered hunting Rikae. Cab's reaction was understandable if he was a wolf with the ladies.

Originally Posted by Kath

She made one post and didn't vote, so the choice of her was probably made for it's safety. How can there be trails if she never spoke?

Did she say anything that might have indicated giftedness on day 0 or their trial day? I'll check in a minute. We can't count on Roa being the gifted.

Originally Posted by Menel

Valier could be an option, but it still hangs on whether Legate was telling the truth about being innocent.

This may be the last day and you're voting for someone whose guilt depends on a dying player's words?

Originally Posted by Val

but why would the wolves not have killed him last night? and why the sudden turn, almost blindly I may add...towards me?

I think Menel not being killed doesn't point to one way or another. The wolves can't know how many there are of each gifted, and if he was the ranger there was a chance that another ranger was protecting him.
But Valier, first you say you're sure Legate was a gifted, then that there's a good chance Menel is the ranger.

Originally Posted by Isabell

I myself am leaning towards taking our chances with lynching Lommy. Even if it is a wasted lynch our numbers are a bit better. If we choose to lynch someone else, odds are we will choose wrongly. Then toMorrow we will only have one more than the wolves, assuming whomever is targeted is not saved by protection.

How come you're so sure of both Rikae being a wolf and that trying to lynch Lommy now is a good idea?

Originally Posted by sally

However, if Lommie knew that Noggie was the guardian, she would know she wouldn't need to protect herself during the night.

I agree with you about this. I find it much more likely that there's just one guardian, as it's, after all, a role which can prove seriously catastrophic.

[Aganzir]

Nothing there. She looked definitely the most ordoish of those three. Why on earth was she killed if the wolves knew there was a plenty of gifteds around as well, or did I miss some subtle gifted hints? I refuse to believe the wolves picked a random kill.

Anyway, I'm off for a while.

[Valier]

well I'm off for work and I see nothing has changed. I still have high suspicions that Menel is indeed a wolf. I'm still not quite sure of his gung-ho behavior towards me. I do however think that McCaber is far more likely a wolf. His last post was just reiterating what has already been said and for a Ordo/Gifted that is very unhelpful.

++McCaber

Good luck all! May we all cringe our noses happily at the smell of burn fur today.

[Kath]

Here's a comment from sally I don't understand:

However, if Lommie knew that Noggie was the guardian, she would know she wouldn't need to protect herself during the night.

Why? I just really don't get where you're coming from here.

With this Immortality thing, there are two choices it seems. Lommy either protected herself last Night or toDay. If it's toDay and we try and lynch her that gives us a wasted lynch. If we try to lynch another wolf it helps us far more than trying to lynch someone who may possibly be immune to it.

Now, as to who we have as possible wolves.

Valier ~ pretty high up on the suspicion list of many, the only thing giving me real trouble is that Lommy outed her. As bold wolves go Lommy is obviously up there with the best of them so I wouldn't put it past her to reveal a fellow wolf. Valier is the main force behind suspicion of Menel here, yet the quotes she pulls out to 'prove' his wolvishness only serve to make it look like she is the wolf (post 402). Says if there were to be a wolvish sacrifice it would be McCaber. The thing with Valier is that she says a lot of things I actually quite agree with (apart from the Nog/Rik lover story) but she says them in such an odd fashiom. I'm not used to a Valier coming across as so ... desperate sounding, and I think that more than anything is what has me convinced of her wolvishness.

McCaber ~ changed his ideas once he found out Nog was thinking about taking Rikae with him rather than Lommy. If McCaber is a wolf along with Lommy that would only really make sense if Rikae was an innocent, otherwise McCaber is still sending a fellow wolf to the grave.

Menel ~ I can see why he is coming across as suspicious but I still think he is actually the Ranger. He has a bad habit of looking wolvish, it gets him killed in the early Days often, but I still think I can see some logic in his early revelation. As to why the wolves would not have killed him last Night it could have been in order to set up a .. well a set up, or possibly they thought there might be another Ranger that might protect him. Whatever the case, I still think he's telling the truth. There's a little group very ready to lynch him, with Valier and McCaber (two people I find very suspicious at the moment) the leaders of it, pushing me to think he is what he says he is.

As I was reading through I have another person that looks a bit odd and that is Izzy. If we lynch Lommy toDay and nothing happens we waste tomorrow in basically repeating a Day. She's also one with the Menel must be a wolf because he didn't die theory. However, Valier says she'll look at her and there is some logic behind what she said even if I don't agree with it. What she said niggles at me but I'm not sure it's enough for full blown suspicion.

Anyway, right now I have Valier at the very top of my suspect list and I'm pretty sure that is where my vote will be going. I would rather see her dead than McCaber because it is her that is following Lommy with trying to confuse (the lovers idea, the idea that Nog was not the Hunter and the idea that Lommy is merely a Cobbler and so might count toward innocent numbers).

[THE Ka]

Originally Posted by Agan

Ms. Joyce, why are you implying that Lommy was protected tonight? So that we could try to lynch her today, find her protected and help the wolves win (I'm speaking about the worst-case scenario, which we should consider to be true in order to avoid a fatal error)?
Ok, I know I might be flushing a gifted out by asking this, but I don't think it really matters anymore. I found your statement (especially repeating that you know she was protected) weird.

Ms. Aganzir, Lommy casted the decisive vote= she could be immune from vote/attack either for last night or for today. I am certain that the immortality bit was used last night.
I don't think we should lynch her toDay, it doesn't make immediate sense, and I wish I had more time to reason all of this, but I have RL things this morning and can't be late. Again.

It might still matter, maybe I like my role... Amoungst the living. Then again, it is of course no consequence of mine whether I die or not. Though, I like the idea of living and being a supporting character and player.

My lips are sealed beyond that. I know you are clever enough to find the hints. If I am or not, so what. I just am interested in thinking about others right now, since my own life in this game matters because of it.

Originally Posted by Kath

McCaber is a wolf along with Lommy that would only really make sense if Rikae was an innocent, otherwise McCaber is still sending a fellow wolf to the grave.

Which, I can see some logic in, distraction wise. If there is five of them amoung us, at least two are showing some fur. I think they might be able to sacrifice one for four, it is a common near-end game tactic (or when it is felt the game is ending). It all depends how eager our wolvies are.

I am really sorry about this, but I have to leave, now. I think I might already be late for my exam, ugh. Wish I could explain more, but I am out of time and won't make it back before deadline.

++McCaber


~ Ka

[Aganzir]

Looks like this is going to be a relatively quiet day. Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Kath

Why? I just really don't get where you're coming from here.

The way I understood it was that if Nog was the guardian, Lommy had little or no chance to get killed during the night. I don't know about others, but at least I've been thinking there's more likely just one guardian.

Originally Posted by Kath

McCaber ~ changed his ideas once he found out Nog was thinking about taking Rikae with him rather than Lommy. If McCaber is a wolf along with Lommy that would only really make sense if Rikae was an innocent, otherwise McCaber is still sending a fellow wolf to the grave.

Rather send one to the grave than two. Had Nog not been lynched, he'd have taken also Lommy the next night. So I can see the sense in that also.

Ka, logically thinking I wouldn't be that sure. Not that it matters anymore, though. I don't think she will be lynched today anyway.

Voting record
Menel: Valier
Brinn: Cab
Val: Cab
Ka: Cab
(Cab-3, Val-1)

Left to vote: sally, Cab, Lommy, Kath, Zali, Izzy, Agan

Thus far it looks like Cab's going to be killed, and that's a good thing (at least IMO). He's a wolf or I'll eat my Swedish textbook (and am sure that I won't start missing it).

[Thinlómien]

The one I think we shouldn't lynch in any case is Brinniel. She seems innocent to me.

The ones we should lynch, double-lynch actually, are Kath and Aganzir. I'm sure they're gif... err... wolves.

There's some advice I'd like to give.
Protector(s), I suggest you protect Kath next Night.
Defender(s), I suggest you dream of Aganzir next Night.
Councellor(s), I suggest you ally yourself/ves with Sally and Valier, at least. Possibly with THE Ka, Aganzir and McCaber too.
Wolves, I suggest you kill McCaber.

What else?

Originally Posted by Kath

I'm recanting my suspicion of Ka somewhat mostly because she came out with the Immortality explanatlieion. I'm aware that was in the rules but if she was a wolf I doubt she'd help us avoid the possibility of a wasted lynch. So, let's have a look at McCaber and Var.

What? Just because she knows the rules she's not a wolf? Fine logic.

Originally Posted by Kath

Lommy was trying very hard to stay alive yesterDay, would a fellow wolf be quite so bold as to try and get her killed even if it was through Nog? I don't know.

I'm sure there was no wolf in ww history who ever did that. Besides, yesterDay the main lynch candidates were I, Nogrod and McCaber himself, so why couldn't he have done that?

Originally Posted by Kath

Oh yes, and Naria, I said I would look at why she was killed but there's nothing to look at. She made one post and didn't vote, so the choice of her was probably made for it's safety. How can there be trails if she never spoke?

What about Day0 and trials?

Originally Posted by Kath

Everyone knows Valier's instincts, why not get rid of her if you have the chance? Well, because she is a wolf.

Or because she should be let to play more than one Day for a change? Or because she's completely wrong with her famous instincts? Or because she looks like a cobbler? There are dozens of reasons.

Originally Posted by Brinniel

Right now, I honestly don't like how Menel pulls for the lynching of Lommy...after Kath's post, he should know it would be too risky. He also leaves open the slight possiblity of Lommy's innocence, which I don't believe for one second...wavering even slightly about something like that seems wolfy to me.

Some of us are risk-takers, Brinn - not everyone is a sheep like you. What's wrong with Menel being a risk-taker? And wavering? You seem to forget the crucial point which is that non-Defender gifteds and ordos don't know the facts, unlike you wolves and possibly the Defenders, so they can't be sure. Fishy, Brinn, fishy.

Originally Posted by Menel

My apologies for not seeing the immortality thing.

AN APOLOGY! WEREWOLF LOREBOOK CHAPTER 1: "WOLVES APOLOGISE"! I'M SURE YOU'VE ALL READ IT! LYNCH HIM! LYNCH! (sorry, I just realised I like CAPS LOCK and wow, I jsut realised the "caps" is just not a random term, but short for "capitals" as in "capital letters"... omg, I'm so silly. )

Originally Posted by Menel

Valier could be an option, but it still hangs on whether Legate was telling the truth about being innocent.

I think all declarations of innocence, unless specified, should be ignored. Really. We could all be just calling ourselves innocent and then we couldn't lynch anybody becasue they said they're innocent and you have to trust people in principle, or that's my principle, not in ww, though, and yes, what was I saying, oh, I got a hilarious idea, let's just all pronounce ourselves innocents so no one gets lynched. I'll start:

I AM INNOCENT.

Originally Posted by Valier

hello dear villagers. let me apologize again for my lateness. I have read through most of yesterday but I wanted to make a few things clear.

Another apologising wolf! KILL HER!

Originally Posted by Valier

Really if he was the Ranger how would we ever know?

I know. Let's lynch him and wait what kind of information comes about.

Originally Posted by Valier

I, my fellow villagers am an Innocent.

Yay, Valier joined my decalration experiment before I even started it! You must be a seer, Val!

Originally Posted by Izzie

I myself am leaning towards taking our chances with lynching Lommy. Even if it is a wasted lynch our numbers are a bit better.

Izzie, my friend, whose numbers? Ours or ours? Anyway, I fail to see your point, if you lynched me and I was protected, the numbers would be exactly the same as this morning. Or am I missing something?

Oh, I need a pause. I'll reply the rest of the posts a bit later. *sigh*

edit: xed with ka and removed about 99% of the content... sorry
edit2: bolded Izzie's name and removed the sentence "I'm a wolf"