Them Dwarven folk.

[Groin Redbeard]

I was thinking about making a thread about this, but I thought it better to keep this thread revived.

What do we know about Dwarves wielding bows?

I know Thorin wielded a bow in the Hobbit, when the Dales people came to get their fair share of the treasure. Does anybody know any other references regarding darf bows?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Groin Redbeard

I know Thorin wielded a bow in the Hobbit, when the Dales people came to get their fair share of the treasure. Does anybody know any other references regarding darf bows?

Of course also when the Dwarves were hunting in the Mirkwood with the bows Beorn gave them. The bows are not mentioned in the battle of Azanulbizar and I would think that in battles with the goblins underground or with heavy-armoured ones even in open field the Dwarves would not use the bows that often, as it surely won't be much effective. There is no mention of shooting from the Dwarves' side in the Book of Mazarbul, and as far as I know, there are not arrows mentioned even in the description of the room of Mazarbul (so no funny arrows sticking out of a skeleton like in the movie): all the weapons mentioned are axes and swords (both dwarven and orcish).

However, I think something may be in the Silmarillion. Definitely the Petty-Dwarves had their own history with bows, but aside from that, maybe the other Dwarves used them somewhere in the battles? I'd have to look.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Groin Redbeard

What do we know about Dwarves wielding bows?

I'm probably taking this quite away from the original question, but: what did the Dwarves eat? Where did they get their food? It would make sense to me that they got most of their food from trade with humans (like the Dwarves of Erebor probably traded with the Dalemen for wheat and other agriculture products). But seeing that there are animals in the mountains, too, I could imagine Dwarves of the Blue Mountains hunting deer or other deer-like animals living in the mountains. That would make sense. And if they hunted deer, they most probably did it with bows. So I would say that at least some dwarves were skilled in archery, regardless of whether it was a part of their warrior training or not.

[zxcvbn]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

I'm probably taking this quite away from the original question, but: what did the Dwarves eat? Where did they get their food? It would make sense to me that they got most of their food from trade with humans (like the Dwarves of Erebor probably traded with the Dalemen for wheat and other agriculture products). But seeing that there are animals in the mountains, too, I could imagine Dwarves of the Blue Mountains hunting deer or other deer-like animals living in the mountains. That would make sense. And if they hunted deer, they most probably did it with bows. So I would say that at least some dwarves were skilled in archery, regardless of whether it was a part of their warrior training or not.

Well, it appears that the Dwarves of Thorin's company had relatively poor eyesight, even the youngsters Fili and Kili. Bilbo could see better than any of them. So I imagine they weren't that skilled with archery(compared with other races). As for Dwarves from the Blue Mountains, I believe they purchased food from the Elves of Lindon or from the Shire(Thorin only regarded Hobbits as 'food growers').

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by zxcvbn

Well, it appears that the Dwarves of Thorin's company had relatively poor eyesight, even the youngsters Fili and Kili. Bilbo could see better than any of them. So I imagine they weren't that skilled with archery(compared with other races).

Funny. I always read it the way that Bilbo had good eyesight, not that the Dwarves had bad eyesight.

Originally Posted by zxcvbn

As for Dwarves from the Blue Mountains, I believe they purchased food from the Elves of Lindon or from the Shire(Thorin only regarded Hobbits as 'food growers').

Agreed, but it would make sense that they would "produce" even a small amount if it themselves by hunting, as they were certainly capable of it.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Funny. I always read it the way that Bilbo had good eyesight, not that the Dwarves had bad eyesight.

Indeed. [/END OF OFF-TOPIC]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Agreed, but it would make sense that they would "produce" even a small amount if it themselves by hunting, as they were certainly capable of it.

Well, once again, with the lack of examples among "normal" Dwarves, I thought about Mim and the Petty-Dwarves. He could shoot, that much seems clear from the story, but mainly we hear about him collecting some roots. One could presume the Dwarves also collected these things (though probably not basing their nutrition only on that), or even cultivated some fungi and other strange things in the underground, what do you say on that? Nevertheless, I believe they must have hunted at least something - and not just underground, that means, to return to the original topic, that they probably used bows for hunt (as it is very effective).

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by zxcvbn

As for Dwarves from the Blue Mountains, I believe they purchased food from the Elves of Lindon or from the Shire(Thorin only regarded Hobbits as 'food growers').

I think the idea that they purchased all (or even the major deal of) their food is quite impossible. Roughly generalised, to be selfsupporting is the ideal of every great kingdom, and I can see it apply to dwarves much better than any humans or elves.

I wouldn't be surprised if dwarves had some mushroom farms. Easy to grow even inside a mountain and tasty. And surely there are some underground lakes that provide them with fish as well.

However, given the dwarves' physique (really, you can't get those muscles just through genes), I think they must eat some meat as well. Granted, there's protein also in fish, but a fish-mushroom diet would be quite boring. Personally I can see dwarves hunting (with bows, slings or something similar). And what about cattle herds? They can graze on the mountains in the summer and don't need that many people to watch over them anyway. Dried or salted meat doesn't go bad very quickly, and if need be more animals can be slaughtered during the winter.

I'm not sure if they could have any animals inside the mountain, though. Could they stand the lack of daylight (or could the dwarves stand the smell)?
Well, maybe goats, hens or something?
Or now that I think it, even cows. Probably they would enjoy their lives better than animals in factory farms these days, anyway.

edit: crossed with uncle Leggie

[zxcvbn]

Originally Posted by Aganzir

I think the idea that they purchased all (or even the major deal of) their food is quite impossible. Roughly generalised, to be selfsupporting is the ideal of every great kingdom, and I can see it apply to dwarves much better than any humans or elves.

Actually they DID purchase all their food supplies. Atleast whenever there were communities of Elves or Men nearby.

Fathers would beg us to take their sons as apprentices, and pay us handsomely, especially in food-supplies, which we never bothered to grow or find for ourselves.

And whenever Dwarves were isolated from Elves and Men, they hunted animals and gathered wild roots instead of farming or herding. Example: the Petty Dwarves.

Maybe they were just poor at farming and herding? They certainly didn't seem to have much harmony with nature.

They are a tough, thrawn race for the most part, secretive, laborious, retentive of the memory of injuries (and of benefits), lovers of stone, of gems, of things that take shape under the hands of the craftsmen rather than things that live by their own life.

[Alfirin]

Maybe Terry Prachett is right and dwarves really do have a fondness for eating rat.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by zxcbvn

Actually they DID purchase all their food supplies. Atleast whenever there were communities of Elves or Men nearby.

I feel like arguing. Because even though the Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain did - just as the quote says - get their food from their neighbours, that probably isn't how it goes with Dwarves of other places. Not all of them had such exceptionally warm relationships with their neighbours.

And as to the Dwarves of the Blue Mountains - Shire is very far away to be the main source of food and I really can't see there being much of friendly communication between the Elves and the Dwarves of the Lindon area. It makes sense they had some communication and trade, but it'd be very odd if the Dwarves got most of their food from the Elves - as the two races didn't like each other very much in late times.

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by zxcvbn

Actually they DID purchase all their food supplies. Atleast whenever there were communities of Elves or Men nearby.

That's not logical. The dwarves were intelligent enough to realise what happens if a war breaks out or there's some other catastrophe which stops trade. And even if Gimli could set Galadriel's hairs in imperishable crystal, I doubt the dwarves were able to preserve food in the same way.
No, they had to be able to produce food also on their own.

Originally Posted by zxc

And whenever Dwarves were isolated from Elves and Men, they hunted animals and gathered wild roots instead of farming or herding. Example: the Petty Dwarves.

Maybe small families and communities did, but that's not enough to feed a considerable sized society.

Originally Posted by zxc

Maybe they were just poor at farming and herding? They certainly didn't seem to have much harmony with nature.

So maybe they were the ones who developed fertilizers and industrial agriculture? To Tolkien's view of things that would probably mean about the same as "not much harmony with nature."

Originally Posted by HoME XII

Thus there grew up in those regions the economy, later characteristic of the dealings of Dwarves and Men (including Hobbits): Men became the chief providers of food, as herdsmen, shepherds, and landtillers, which the Dwarves exchanged for work as builders, roadmakers &tc.

I believe this is what you meant. However, I fail to see it says trade with Men was the only source of food for dwarves. Rather, I think it profited Men most to sell food- and that most of the food the dwarves bought came from Men.

Originally Posted by Alfirin

Maybe Terry Prachett is right and dwarves really do have a fondness for eating rat.

Originally Posted by zxc

And as for the Shire being too far way for trade, how do you think the Dwarves knew of pipe weed?

Smoking of pipe-weed spread among Dwarves from Bree, says the Prologue. I don't remember what else has been said about pipe-weed, but it's hard to believe it grows only near the Shire, so trade isn't necessarily needed for the dwarves to get it.

**

And now that I think it, mushroom farming sounds even more and more probable. A union between Aulë and Yavanna- things that grow underground and are eaten by Aulë's folk. How romantic.

[zxcvbn]

Originally Posted by Aganzir

Smoking of pipe-weed spread among Dwarves from Bree, says the Prologue. I don't remember what else has been said about pipe-weed, but it's hard to believe it grows only near the Shire, so trade isn't necessarily needed for the dwarves to get it.

Bree is even farther from the Blue Mountains than the Shire. And it's unlikely that the Dwarves grew it themselves, as it needed open spaces and lots of sunlight. And the Elves didn't smoke, so they wouldn't grow it either. So trade it is.