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Old 09-21-2007, 01:19 AM   #4
Findegil
King's Writer
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
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Findegil is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
I think that the Dagor Dagorath was never discarded. The second prophecy might have been but I would not sign such a statement. At least I think both should be discussed single handed and not together.

The Dagor Dagorath could still be valid concept in Tolkiens mind even when he skipped the second prophecy. So I will start my discussion with the Dagor Dagorath:
This phrase is as fare as I know not from the second prophecy but from a text in the chapter on the Isatir in Unfinished Tales. It is their given in short poem speaking about Gandalf. Since it is clear that the poem is much later then The Lord of the Rings it becomes clear that the Dagor Dagorath was at least at this time still in existence as a concept for the end of Arda.

For the problems that we have with certain elements in the second Prophecy I think we should look at a quiet different source about the end of Arda for potential answers: In the Ainulindale we are told that the end of the music, which certainly corresponds to the end of Arda (Marred - at least), came by a direct intervention of Eru. Eru is ever free to choose his agents as he had chosen Manwe as the main instrument of the second theme and Varda to carry the unsullied light of the flame of Anar into the world or Gandalf for rescuing what was left of the glory of Numenor against Sauron. As we see in Gandalfs example Eru has not any problem to resurrect someone from death, least of all a Man whose feä was with him after his death anyway. And would anybody doubt Erus ability to recreate the black-sword for his agent? So I think nothing really speaks against the second prophecy.

Respectfuly
Findegil
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