Galadriel's Hair.

[Milady Revenwyn]

Hey, I *think* I remember reading something about how in her younger years Galadriel refused to cut her hair to (I think) be fashioned into a jewel. Am I correct? Who asked such a bold request? Where is it found?

I can't remember. Help me please!

[davem]

Originally Posted by Milady Revenwyn

Hey, I *think* I remember reading something about how in her younger years Galadriel refused to cut her hair to (I think) be fashioned into a jewel. Am I correct? Who asked such a bold request? Where is it found?

I can't remember. Help me please!

It was Feanor. This from The History of Galadriel & Celeborn:

...her hair held a marvel unmatched. It was golden like the hair of her father & of her foremother Indis, but richer & more radiant, for its gold was touched by some memory of the starlike silver of her mother; & the Eldar said that the light of the Two Trees, Laurelin & Telperion, had been snared in her tresses. Many thought that this saying first gave to Feanor the thought of imprisoning & blending the light of the Two Trees that later took shape in his hands as the Silmarils. For Feanor beheld the hair of Galadriel with wonder & delight. He begged three times for a tress, but Galadriel would not give him even one hair.

Actually, I started a thread on Hair in M-e a while back http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=12132

[Milady Revenwyn]

Thank you! Erm, what book is that in? I moved and I don't have all my books with me, unfortunately, or else I would have looked it up myself.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

It's in the Unfinished Tales.

[Milady Revenwyn]

Aha, and that's one of the books that I had to unfortunately leave behind when I moved out of the house.

Thanks!

I don't blame Galadriel for not giving her hair to Feanor... he was a jerk.

[Meriadoc1961]

I did not know that! Interesting! It makes her giving three strands to Gimli, a Dwarf, even more remarkable!

Merry

[Folwren]

Yes, it does. I read that part yesterday and this thread and the incident with Feanor came immediately to mind.

'There is nothing, Lady Galadriel,' said Gimli, bowing low and stammering. 'Nothing, unless it might be - unless it is permitted to ask, nay, to name a single strand of your hair. . . '

The Elves stirred and murmured with astonishment, and Celeborn gazed at the Dwarf in wonder, but the Lady smiled.

Little wonder the elves had such a reaction if Feanor had asked for this and had been refused.

[Lhunardawen]

Since we're on the topic of Galadriel's hair, this random thought probably wouldn't be out of place:

Reading this thread, I was reminded of a post I made more than a couple of years ago in one of the 'Galadriel chapters' in the FotR CbC, in which I pointed out that, in parallel of Telperion and Laurelin, Celeborn had silver hair while Galadriel's hair was golden. Could there be any basis in this seeming assignment of silver as masculine and gold feminine?

And yes, I know that Celebrian is female, but you can't deny that these two pairs are special.

[Rikae]

Interesting - I guess it must be linked with the gender of the sun and moon - like in Germanic languages (except English, of course, where the genders are usually switched - French or Roman influence, perhaps? Er, I guess one of our linguists can answer that) ... actually, I've always wondered why northern Europeans assigned the genders of the sun and moon the opposite of those in the south, and whether this tells us anything about gender roles in these cultures, but I guess that's completely off topic, so I'll be quiet now.

OK, more on topic - why did Tolkien assign the gender of the sun and moon the way he did? Forgive me if that's a dumb question...

[Raynor]

Originally Posted by Rikae

why did Tolkien assign the gender of the sun and moon the way he did?

In Myths Transformed, Tolkien states that the Moon had a more combative role - against the night - thus warranting, to some extent, a masculine presence. By and large, males do seem to take a more martial role:

[The Moon] is to be a subsidiary light to mitigate night (as Melkor had made it), and also a 'vessel of watch and ward' to circle the world

Moreover, Arien, as the brighter light, seems more fitting, seeing that Varda is the valie of the stars. It is an interesting coherence in gender symbolism.

[davem]

Just adding to Raynor's answer, Tolkien's source is clearly Norse myth:

From Snorri's Prose Edda:

XI. Then said Gangleri: "How does he govern the course of the sun or of the moon?" Hárr answered: "A certain man was named Mundilfari, who had two children; they were so fair and comely that he called his son Moon, and his daughter Sun, and wedded her to the man called Glenr. But the gods were incensed at that insolence, and took the brother and sister, and set them up in the heavens; they caused Sun to drive those horses that drew the chariot, of the sun, which the gods had fashioned, for the world's illumination, from that glowing stuff which flew out of Múspellheim. Those horses are called thus: Early-Wake and All-Strong; and under the shoulders of the horses the gods set two wind-bags to cool them, but in some records that is called 'iron-coolness.' Moon steers the course of the moon, and determines its waxing and waning. He took from the earth two children, called Bil and Hjúki, they that went from the well called Byrgir, bearing on their shoulders the cask called Sægr, and the pole Simul. Their father is named Vidfinnr. These children follow Moon, as may be seen from the earth."

XII. Then said Gangleri: "The sun fares swiftly, and almost as if she were afraid: she could not hasten her course any the more if she feared her destruction." Then Hárr made answer: "It is no marvel that she hastens furiously: close cometh he that seeks her, and she has no escape save to run away." Then said Gangleri: "Who is he that causes her this disquiet?" Hárr replied: "It is two wolves; and he that runs after her is called Skoll; she fears him, and he shall take her. But he that leaps before her is called Hati Hródvitnisson. He is eager to seize the moon; and so it must be." Then said Gangleri: "What is the race of the wolves? Hárr answered: "A witch dwells to the east of Midgard, in the forest called Ironwood: in that wood dwell the troll-women, who are known as Ironwood-Women. The old witch bears many giants for sons, and all in the shape of wolves; and from this source are these wolves sprung. The saying runs thus: from this race shall come one that shall be mightiest of all, he that is named Moon-Hound; he shall be filled with the flesh of all those men that die, and he shall swallow the moon, and sprinkle with blood the heavens and all the air; thereof shall the sun lose her shining, and the winds in that day shall be unquiet and roar on every side. So it says in Völuspá:

Eastward dwells the Old One in Ironwood,
And there gives birth to Fenrir's brethren;
There shall spring of them all a certain one,
The moon's taker in troll's likeness.

He is filled with flesh of fey men.
Reddens the gods' seats with ruddy blood-gouts;
Swart becomes sunshine in summers after,
The weather all shifty. Wit ye yet, or what?"

Compare The Sil account:

The maiden whom the Valar chose from among the Maiar to guide the vessel of the Sun was named Arien, and he that steered the island of the Moon was Tilion. In the days of the Trees Arien had tended the golden flowers in the gardens of Vana, and watered them with the bright dews of Laurelin; but Tilion was a hunter of the company of Orome, and he had a silver bow. He was a lover of silver, and when he would rest he forsook the woods of Orome, and going into L6rien he lay in dream by the pools of Este, in Telperion's flickering beams; and he begged to be given the task of tending for ever the last Flower of Silver. Arien the maiden was mightier than he, and she was chosen because she had not feared the heats of Laurelin, and was unhurt by them, being from the beginning a spirit of fire, whom Melkor had not deceived nor drawn to his service. Too bright were the eyes of Arien for even the Eldar to look on, and leaving Valinor she forsook the form and raiment which like the Valar she had worn there, and she was as a naked flame, terrible in the fullness of her splendour......

But Morgoth hated the new lights, and was for a while confounded by this unlooked-for stroke of the Valar. Then he assailed Tilion, sending spirits of shadow against him, and there was strife in Ilmen beneath the paths of the stars; but Tilion was victorious. And Arien Morgoth feared with a great fear, but dared not come nigh her, having indeed no longer the power; for as he grew in malice, and sent forth from himself the evil that he conceived in lies and creatures of wickedness, his might passed into them and was dispersed, and he himself became ever more bound to the earth, unwilling to issue from his dark strongholds. With shadows he hid himself and his servants from Arien, the glance of whose eyes they could not long endure; and the lands near his dwelling were shrouded in fumes and great clouds.