More than meets the Eye

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Um... I'm not sure, but I was under the impression that they ended buried in the ruins of Barad-Dur. Maybe some late Fourth-Age archaeologists could be able to find them, but I don't think Aragorn&co would have any access to them, or any need to solve these things.

Sure, and the One Ring rolled down the Anduin to the Sea...

It was just a thought, as a body has clothes, stuff ends up in its pocketses, and what a good start to some fanfic (or ME AD&D campaign) this would make.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by alatar

It was just a thought, as a body has clothes, stuff ends up in its pocketses, and what a good start to some fanfic (or ME AD&D campaign) this would make.

Yes, but come on, that's one of the most (tries to think of a corresponding English word. Heck, who cares) overcooked thing which comes to a person's mind in the first moment when he wants to make a sequel. A typical "braque fantasy" story. "Gwahlrd Ndhaarad from Khand was a simple peasant. In his eighteen years, he is banished from his tribe. Treading the vast desert of Gorgoroth, he finds an ancient artifact of incredible power - the armor of Sauron the Dark Lord. Gwahlrd returns to his homeland, where he claims the rulership of his tribe and soon, the following tribes as well. What he does not know is, that the will of the Dark Lord still remains in the black armor, and that slowly, he starts to become something even he did not predice... a new Dark Lord of Middle-Earth."
(This could be written on the back of a paperback book, quite many silly fans will certainly buy it.)

(...and of course, under it there will be written: "First book of the Eastwar Saga")

[sallkid]

I believe (but don't quote me on this) that the mountain erupted after the ring was destroyed (the single justifiable case of "base blows up when bad guy dies" in fiction) if the fire was hot eough to melt the one ring, which even dragon-fire could not tarnish, then surely it was hot enough to destroy his raiments and armour (if armour he had) utterly.

[Sir Kohran]

Just wondering...could the four fingers reference from Gollum be a metaphor? Though Sauron is missing his most important 'finger' (the Ring), he still has enough power (sheer military might) to win anyway.

However, the idea of Gollum actually meeting Sauron is a chilling one, when we think of Gandalf's numerous allusions to what actually meeting the dark lord would do to someone. It would explain quite a bit of why Gollum became the way he did.

[Lalwendë]

Why an eye?

The Eye is a powerful symbol in culture as Boro has pointed out - and not least in the symbol of the All-Seeing Eye (as seen on the US banknotes - the eye in the pyramid) which has a sinister and quite complex history. I know Lewis and Williams were interested in the occult/esoteric, and no doubt such topics were discussed between the Inklings - what might Tolkien have picked up on?

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

(...and of course, under it there will be written: "First book of the Eastwar Saga")

Do you know when that series is coming out then?

Okay, so in retrospect it was a little weak, kind of like finding a Ring that allows some dark lord to take over, even though it seems that he was doing a pretty good job without it. Anyway, getting back to my less-weak idea that, to me, you'd want to make sure that nothing remained so that no one could cash in on your tale (Aragorn's kingship entitled him to review all books concerning the End of the Third Age, and think that the Red Book states that others had a hand in its making [Strider: "Think that I appeared more mysterious when you met me in Bree, and if I, your King, remembers correctly, I definitely was NOT eating nachos...]), or, like Isildur, you'd want some token to display showing that indeed the bad guy was truly dead, and didn't the Númenóreans cart (well, boat) Sauron, the Lord of Gifts back to the Land of Gift just to show everyone else that the maia had been humbled?

Originally Posted by sallkid

I believe (but don't quote me on this) that the mountain erupted after the ring was destroyed (the single justifiable case of "base blows up when bad guy dies" in fiction) if the fire was hot eough to melt the one ring, which even dragon-fire could not tarnish, then surely it was hot enough to destroy his raiments and armour (if armour he had) utterly.

Think that Mount Doom was far enough away from Barad-dûr that no lava fell upon the tower. Sauron's abode did collapse, as its foundations were tied to the Ring in some way, but this doesn't mean that something of the old Eye couldn't have survived to be scavenged.

Originally Posted by Sir Kohran

Just wondering...could the four fingers reference from Gollum be a metaphor? Though Sauron is missing his most important 'finger' (the Ring), he still has enough power (sheer military might) to win anyway.

To my knowledge Gollum didn't, at least in this case, wax poetic like Gandalf (or Gimli - PJ has me so confused) about Sauron's reach regarding the storm up on Caradhras. Gollum speaks of Sauron just like any other creature he'd encountered.

However, the idea of Gollum actually meeting Sauron is a chilling one, when we think of Gandalf's numerous allusions to what actually meeting the dark lord would do to someone. It would explain quite a bit of why Gollum became the way he did.

Truly. Think that this speaks to the inherent 'power' within hobbit folk. What other mortal could have been brought before the Lidless Eye and yet retain a fierce independence of will, especially regarding the Ring. That or Gollum was so mixed up in the head that Sauron didn't have anything with which to work.

Originally Posted by Lalwendë

Why an eye?

The 'Clavicle' just didn't inspire the same fear, nor could anyone recognize the symbol ("Uglúk thinks you servants of the ~ eat diacritic marks.")

The Eye is a powerful symbol in culture as Boro has pointed out - and not least in the symbol of the All-Seeing Eye (as seen on the US banknotes - the eye in the pyramid) which has a sinister and quite complex history. I know Lewis and Williams were interested in the occult/esoteric, and no doubt such topics were discussed between the Inklings - what might Tolkien have picked up on?

Been thinking about this. Is it that we humans are very eye-centric? Does this stem from our days (and nights) of being hunted, and by the time you saw the whites of the predator's eyes, it was too late? Does it symbolize the ultimate control, as stated above ala 1984, where someone's always watching you, dampening the good things, by usurping them, and noting/exploiting the bad that you do? Why is the purported #1 fear public speaking? To be in front of a bunch of eyes that, like Sauron, have the power to humiliate you? Never used this one, but everyone always says to get over one's fear, one is to imagine the audience as appearing in its undergarments. Is this how Gollum withstood the gaze of Sauron, as, as we are discussing, DID have a body...?