Verbal Reasoning! - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Legate of Amon Lanc · 06-15-2007, 04:35 AM

Okay. Take the thread, please.

From the beginning I was looking for Hunthor, who was Túrin's companion in the final battle with Glaurung, but died. The same happened in the "kill Sauron" scenario: only Isildur survived, and he was the one who killed Sauron.

I would accept Dorlas as the second answer as well. But the main thing was about Hunthor.

The Might · 06-15-2007, 06:23 AM

Hmm...I was thinking about that, but didn't think about Hunthor.

Shards of Narsil · 06-15-2007, 12:23 PM

I had Hunthor in my head and thought it would fit, but for some reason didn't post. Probably because Legate was laughing at me.

Any way, good job Beanamir!

Beanamir of Gondor · 06-16-2007, 09:15 AM

Wow, I can't believe Hunthor was the right answer. Good riddle, Legate!
Okay, this one is probably pretty easy. It might require explanation, though.

Frodo is to Grishnakh

as

Beren is to ________

FeRaL sHaDoW · 06-17-2007, 02:31 AM

is it

Frodo is to Grishnakh

as

Beren is to Morgoth

The Might · 06-17-2007, 08:50 AM

I'd rather say Sauron.
Grishnakh was trying to find the Ring-bearer (Frodo), out of Sauron's orders just as
Sauron tryed to find Beren out of Melkor's orders.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 06-17-2007, 11:24 AM

Or even Carcharoth could be that. But I think Sauron is more correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shards of Narsil

I had Hunthor in my head and thought it would fit, but for some reason didn't post. Probably because Legate was laughing at me.

Oh, when? Sorry if it ever seemed like that, but I don't remember any such occassion!

Beanamir of Gondor · 06-17-2007, 05:16 PM

Good thinking with Sauron, though if that were my line of reasoning, I probably would prefer Morgoth, just because Grishnakh is so incredibly inferior to Sauron as a servant of evil.

Coincidentally, Legate, Carcaroth is who I was looking for: but that wasn't the reason why. Think less specifically of Frodo's personal relation to Grishnakh...

Legate of Amon Lanc · 06-18-2007, 02:17 PM

Huh! Indeed? Now why... Grishnakh didn't bite off Frodo's arm... nor did Sam sing lullaby to him... nor did he eat the Ring (though he'd certainly like to... bah! maybe not, what would Sauron do to him then if he learned it's inside him?)... not personal, you say? But what then, when they are connected by it? Grishnakh captured, or later also saved Frodo's friends, Merry&Pippin... could it be said that Carcharoth "saved" the Silmaril? Or those who killed him were his friends... Horsemen - Huan? Bah, hobbits did not know the Horsemen... Mablung... I can't think of anything, really.

Maybe - a Nazgul that scared Frodo was supposed to carry Grishnakh over the water? But Carcharoth did not need anything to carry... and the simple relationship Frodo - Sauron - Grishnakh vs. Beren - Morgoth - Carcharoth it's not as you said... that idea would fit more with Shagrat or some other "door guard".

Beanamir of Gondor · 06-19-2007, 07:18 PM

Yes, Frodo-Sauron-Grishnakh is a tie with Beren-Morgoth-Carcaroth. Anyway, since you already know the name itself, here's my reasoning behind it:

Frodo entered Mordor dressed as an Orc: Grishnakh was a notable Orc who served Sauron, Lord of Mordor. (You're right in saying that Shagrat would have done better as an example, because he was at the gates of Mordor when Frodo entered.)
In any case, Beren entered Angband dressed as a Werewolf: Carcaroth was a notable Werewolf who served Morgoth, Lord of Angband.

So there it is. Thread's yours, Legate.

06-15-2007, 04:35 AM	#1
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Finally... Okay. Take the thread, please. From the beginning I was looking for Hunthor, who was Túrin's companion in the final battle with Glaurung, but died. The same happened in the "kill Sauron" scenario: only Isildur survived, and he was the one who killed Sauron. I would accept Dorlas as the second answer as well. But the main thing was about Hunthor. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

06-15-2007, 06:23 AM	#2
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	Hmm...I was thinking about that, but didn't think about Hunthor. __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

06-15-2007, 12:23 PM	#3
Shards of Narsil Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 33	I knew it! I had Hunthor in my head and thought it would fit, but for some reason didn't post. Probably because Legate was laughing at me. Any way, good job Beanamir!

06-16-2007, 09:15 AM	#4
Beanamir of Gondor Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: the Shadow Gallery Posts: 276	Thankee, Shards! Wow, I can't believe Hunthor was the right answer. Good riddle, Legate! Okay, this one is probably pretty easy. It might require explanation, though. Frodo is to Grishnakh as Beren is to ________ __________________ The answer to life is no longer 42. It's 4 8 15 16 23... 42. "I only lent you my body; you lent me your dream."

06-17-2007, 02:31 AM	#5
FeRaL sHaDoW Wight Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 232	is it Frodo is to Grishnakh as Beren is to Morgoth __________________ God created night, but man created darkness....

06-17-2007, 08:50 AM	#6
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	I'd rather say Sauron. Grishnakh was trying to find the Ring-bearer (Frodo), out of Sauron's orders just as Sauron tryed to find Beren out of Melkor's orders. __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

06-17-2007, 05:16 PM	#8
Beanamir of Gondor Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: the Shadow Gallery Posts: 276	Good thinking with Sauron, though if that were my line of reasoning, I probably would prefer Morgoth, just because Grishnakh is so incredibly inferior to Sauron as a servant of evil. Coincidentally, Legate, Carcaroth is who I was looking for: but that wasn't the reason why. Think less specifically of Frodo's personal relation to Grishnakh... __________________ The answer to life is no longer 42. It's 4 8 15 16 23... 42. "I only lent you my body; you lent me your dream."

06-18-2007, 02:17 PM	#9
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Thinking aloud Huh! Indeed? Now why... Grishnakh didn't bite off Frodo's arm... nor did Sam sing lullaby to him... nor did he eat the Ring (though he'd certainly like to... bah! maybe not, what would Sauron do to him then if he learned it's inside him?)... not personal, you say? But what then, when they are connected by it? Grishnakh captured, or later also saved Frodo's friends, Merry&Pippin... could it be said that Carcharoth "saved" the Silmaril? Or those who killed him were his friends... Horsemen - Huan? Bah, hobbits did not know the Horsemen... Mablung... I can't think of anything, really. Maybe - a Nazgul that scared Frodo was supposed to carry Grishnakh over the water? But Carcharoth did not need anything to carry... and the simple relationship Frodo - Sauron - Grishnakh vs. Beren - Morgoth - Carcharoth it's not as you said... that idea would fit more with Shagrat or some other "door guard". __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

06-19-2007, 07:18 PM	#10
Beanamir of Gondor Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: the Shadow Gallery Posts: 276	Yes, Frodo-Sauron-Grishnakh is a tie with Beren-Morgoth-Carcaroth. Anyway, since you already know the name itself, here's my reasoning behind it: Frodo entered Mordor dressed as an Orc: Grishnakh was a notable Orc who served Sauron, Lord of Mordor. (You're right in saying that Shagrat would have done better as an example, because he was at the gates of Mordor when Frodo entered.) In any case, Beren entered Angband dressed as a Werewolf: Carcaroth was a notable Werewolf who served Morgoth, Lord of Angband. So there it is. Thread's yours, Legate. __________________ The answer to life is no longer 42. It's 4 8 15 16 23... 42. "I only lent you my body; you lent me your dream."