I just don't understand.

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by alatar

Hah! I've anticipated your question . Look at the attached picture of my 'fangirls.' Note the one that is riding on her father's shoulders as he walks uphill carrying her sister. Note how said child uses dad's hair as both a way to maintain her perch and a way to guide said dad. Note hair...

No matter how much they tug, and how many times a day I pull some out, still, it remains (note that, in exchange for non-receding hair I had to give up short-term memory, optimism and congeniality).

Pre-cise-ly! It's that bald patch on the top, then. A braid to pull the sides up to cover it.

Originally Posted by alatar

Huh?

I keep forgetting that you New Order Mods probably don't know the heyday of REB, the infamous rpg Return of the Entish Bow and Revenge of the Entish Bow. It's probably a good thing many fangirls didn't read it, as what was done to Movie Legolas might have turned them into death-threatening maenads. We would have had letters from The Society for the Prevention of Cruel Stereotypes Towards Hair Stylists as well.

Originally Posted by alatar

What was the question?

Folwren, I think movie Elrond also came in for his share of jibes. Perhaps PJ had difficulty integrating Tolkien's concept of male elf with his action man perspective?

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

Pre-cise-ly! It's that bald patch on the top, then. A braid to pull the sides up to cover it.

Ah, another sign of age, ma'am, is the gradual loss of acuity. One might take a closer look at said picture to note that, just like on Orlando's bean, there is no recession there, whether sides or top. If you're looking for Amon Rûdh, you have a better chance with a map. And, speaking of acuity, I would also note that as one gets older, mental acuity too feels the effects of time (read my posts if you're not sure). Maybe this is why, in the movie, Elrond drones on and on about the Battle of the Last Alliance and what that 'man' Isildur didn't do, so many years hence - few know now what he's even talking about. Legolas, in contrast, keeps his monologuing to a sentence or two. That being said...

I keep forgetting that you New Order Mods probably don't know the heyday of REB, the infamous rpg Return of the Entish Bow and Revenge of the Entish Bow. It's probably a good thing many fangirls didn't read it, as what was done to Movie Legolas might have turned them into death-threatening maenads. We would have had letters from The Society for the Prevention of Cruel Stereotypes Towards Hair Stylists as well.

Clear as mud.

Originally Posted by Imladris

as I've said -- translating a book to a movie doesn't work. There are bookish elements and there are movie elements and the elves, I think, are decidedly bookish.

Can't say that I agree. The elves could have been portrayed better. Legolas became a one-note assassin, and the elves at Helm's Deep were just cannon fodder. Lothlorien was too brief and too dark. We could have learned more about the elves via Legolas or Arwen as (1) we got to know these characters through the 12+ hours of the movie, and (2) PJ could have, using Gimli and Aragorn respectively, shown us why the elves were different. There were scenes that could have been cut to make time for an elf mini-micro-documentary. Just a few moments, now and then, to show how Legolas or Arwen viewed this Middle Earth.

Don't hate them because they are beautiful...

[Imladris]

Don't hate them because they are beautiful...

I hadn't meant to imply that, because I do love the elves both book and movie (gasp) form.

Legolas became a one-note assassin

And in the book he was....what? Cardboard? That guy over there who's hair colour is in question? I've read the book many times, I don't feel aquainted with Legolas at all, except as one of the nine.

His stunts in the movie were over the top, yet I hardly think that makes him deserving of the title assasin. Legolas killed people in the book too and he did it well.

Lothlorien was too brief and too dark.

I always thought this was harkening back to the fact that the time of the elves was over as they left into the west...

Brief? The Fellowship didn't do anything in Lothlorien besides rest and the mirror scene with Frodo which I am still iffy about how it was portrayed in the movie. But, you must admit, resting and regaining strength is hardly movie material. In movie form, it's a snore fest.

We could have learned more about the elves via Legolas or Arwen as (1) we got to know these characters through the 12+ hours of the movie, and (2) PJ could have, using Gimli and Aragorn respectively, shown us why the elves were different. There were scenes that could have been cut to make time for an elf mini-micro-documentary. Just a few moments, now and then, to show how Legolas or Arwen viewed this Middle Earth.

Much as I love the elves, the story is of Frodo and the Ring and the other nine are not about them. In an already complicated story with multitudes of characters, I don't think it would have...worked...to do what you suggest...though I am wondering if you could provide an example of what you mean?

[Boromir88]

Folwren, personally I think anything is better than 'They run as if the very whips of their masters were behind them.'

I think Tolkien implies a bit of a campy/corny attitude, yet it is humorous...or at least gets a chuckle out of me. For instance 'A plague on the dwaves and their stiff necks!' is just so campy it's funny. Kind of like when Frodo responds to Gildor's little poke:

'And it is also said,' answered Frodo: 'Go not to the Elves for counsel, for they will say both no and yes.'

Or even better, reminds me of the 60's Batman episodes and 'Biff!' 'Pow!' 'Kur-plowee' popped up on the TV in bright colors. Just that kind of humour which I get a chuckle at.

I admit, it's not really Orlando's fault that he's just given bad and Mr. Obvious lines...and I really don't see how he runs like a girl? However, his lines are just the bad cheese, not the good cheese.

[Morsul the Dark]

I love legolas's super growing power as seen in rotk on a horse eowyn barely clears its ankles yet leeglas is up to the the thing's knee

[Lalaith]

On a completely different note:

Quote:
I wonder who will play the elves in The Hobbit Movie. I really hope it's not a ''handsome'' actor, because it just brings the spirit of Tolkien down. People will only go to the movie because people will say: '' Have you already seen that Elf in The Hobbit? He is SO hot, you got to watch it!''
Tolkien can't be forgotten...


Should we not have beautiful music or beautiful scenery or beautiful cinema so that people won't watch the movie for its aesthetic qualities?

No. Of course not.

We should be able to appreciate beauty in all it's shapes, including hot males.

Ah, you fail to appreciate the Hollywood ethos.
Hot young actress falls in love with Bill Murray or Woody Allen = serious art movie
Hot young actress falls in love with Orlando Bloom = frivolous teen flick

You see, we women can't be trusted watching handsome young male actors, we start getting all silly.
Men are not like this. They don't need, for example, Bette Midler playing Arwen to keep their minds on Higher Things.

edit.... I keep forgetting there is no "irony font" ...

[Folwren]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Folwren, personally I think anything is better than 'They run as if the very whips of their masters were behind them.'

Attend, sir. 'The orcs have run before us, as though the very whips of Sauron were behind them.' That might have pleased you. It comes at least from the book.

And I thought the quote was 'the very whips of their master's will were behind them'? But it makes little difference.

I think Tolkien implies a bit of a campy/corny attitude, yet it is humorous...or at least gets a chuckle out of me. For instance 'A plague on the dwaves and their stiff necks!' is just so campy it's funny. Kind of like when Frodo responds to Gildor's little poke:

Yes, those quotes get laughs out of me, too...but it's not Legolas' fault.

Or even better, reminds me of the 60's Batman episodes and 'Biff!' 'Pow!' 'Kur-plowee' popped up on the TV in bright colors. Just that kind of humour which I get a chuckle at.

I don't know of what you speak.

I admit, it's not really Orlando's fault that he's just given bad and Mr. Obvious lines...and I really don't see how he runs like a girl? However, his lines are just the bad cheese, not the good cheese.

I don't see how he runs like a girl, either. See, I do understand you disliking some of his quotes (even my sister and I laugh at his lack of quotes from the FotR), and I also understand the distain for his outlandish stunt tricks, but it's the jokes about his looks and his running and stuff like that that I don't understand...hence the forming of this thread.

Originally Posted by Morsul

I love legolas's super growing power as seen in rotk on a horse eowyn barely clears its ankles yet leeglas is up to the the thing's knee

Now, that is funny. I'd never even noticed, but then I've only seen the RotK 3 or 4 times, at most.

-- Folwren

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Imladris

And in the book he was....what? Cardboard? That guy over there who's hair colour is in question? I've read the book many times, I don't feel aquainted with Legolas at all, except as one of the nine.

It seems to me that as the movies progressed that Legolas became less elf prince and more 'straight man' to Gimli. That and he, on most occasions, killed things with a bow. He provides information when only he, Aragorn and Gimli are on the screen as we might believe more easily that he would 'know' things unlike the buffoon Gimli. The book Legolas, to me, was more than that. He makes the comment somewhere regarding 'traveling with you children,' meaning that he is much older than he seems. He also does not sleep as we humans, and can dream while he runs. Later in the books we learn of Legolas's love for the sea.

His stunts in the movie were over the top, yet I hardly think that makes him deserving of the title assasin. Legolas killed people in the book too and he did it well.

Memorable Legolas movie scenes: When, in Moria when we're on the 'stairs' of Khazad-dum, we follow one of the elf's arrows right into the head of an orc. In TTT he slides down the stairs on a shield and also jumps up on a horse in a most interesting fashion. In RotK Legolas kills an oliphaunt single-handedly. I have to really think to produce more scenes easily (and that's hard this time of the day ).

I always thought this was harkening back to the fact that the time of the elves was over as they left into the west...

The extended version is a bit better, but my wife and I (she never read the books) were somewhat confused when we saw Lothlorien. It looked too otherworldly, and when the Fellowship walk up the stairs on the tree in the dark, I wasn't sure what I was to 'see and think.' When I think elves, I think more 'green.'

Brief? The Fellowship didn't do anything in Lothlorien besides rest and the mirror scene with Frodo which I am still iffy about how it was portrayed in the movie. But, you must admit, resting and regaining strength is hardly movie material. In movie form, it's a snore fest.

I understand what you mean, but the theatrical version seemed rushed - 'gotta go!' The extended version was better. Could we have seen Galadriel showing how she keeps Sauron at bay? How about the Fellowship walking through the place while elves do whatever they do? Sing, dance, make rope, magic capes, etc?

Much as I love the elves, the story is of Frodo and the Ring and the other nine are not about them. In an already complicated story with multitudes of characters, I don't think it would have...worked...to do what you suggest...though I am wondering if you could provide an example of what you mean?

Whoa there! See, I'm a critic, and that means that I don't possess a single creative cell in my body...I only quibble and quip about what I don't like and how I could have done it better (without ever offering any positive suggestions or being able to produce any tangible results) . Anyway, in the much maligned drinking scene in TTT, we could have had Legolas remark, "A drinking game? With beer? Like I haven't played one of those before. [rolls eyes, then with a grin] I'll leave you children to it...there wouldn't be any wine, would there?" That's surely not Oscar material, but is there a way that we could show that Legolas isn't only a killer and more sensitive to the world ('evil approaches') but also thousands of years old and in possession of a personality?

Likewise, I would have liked to have seen an overt display of Gimli's strength, just to demonstrate that he's not a bearded armor-wearing axe-wielding hobbit. In the warg scene, we see that Gimli is 'tough-stuff' as he is not crushed by the weight of two wargs and one smelly orc, but I would have liked to have seen something more clear.