Il Principe (of Beleriand...)

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Anguirel

Of course, alatar, you're free to advocate shunning active resistance, but I don't see the point.

Active resistance? I think that we know where that will lead (read the Sil). My activity is survival at almost all costs. I'm using the insect model. Camoflague, so that we cannot be detected, and generalization, where any group can restart the colony.

We saw Fingolfin fall, and though the Naugrim were brave, Glaurung's fire still burned in Beleriand. And what did Hurin's bravery buy him?

There is a Norse saying "A brave man dies once, a coward many times." Destruction will come to the Noldor, flee they ever so far. Best to weather the storm!

Another said, "Dead men tell no tales," and I would had, 'have no children.' A prudent person realizes that some pursuits are futile, and so adapts. As you sit in the Halls of Mandos you can be reading about my peoples in the future (I'll send progress reports), and we will sing songs about your brave dead. Thanks for giving Morgoth something else to do so that he left us alone.

I suggest-build up grand alliances with Elves of whatever stamp, if at all possible. Swear an oath of mutual respect (like that sworn by the Greek princes of the Iliad). Foster connections with Men and Naugrim. With unity, the free peoples of Beleriand could have been greater than a thousand Valarin relief forces!

And how is this different than what occurred? With all of those alliances and the ilk, someone does something 'wrong,' and the lies of Morgoth start to take hold, then suddenly it becomes a big mess. Wasn't that the Nirnaeth Arnoediad?

[Kuruharan]

I would be inclined to head east over the Ered Luin

You're not going to be in a good position for active resistance from waaay over there.

or in the Ered Luin themselves. A mountain stronghold could be held with a network of caves beneath it.

You are going to have to rethink this. The dwarves would not allow it. The Blue Mountains were their personal stomping ground and they were spread all up and down those mountains. They would probably fight you rather than let you establish another kingdom there to compete with them for resources. They would probably also be less than happy about having a power that would be so obvious a target for Morgoth in their midst.

[drigel]

You're not going to be in a good position for active resistance from waaay over there.

Forget Beleriand altogether. Head east of the Blue Mnts and set up an initial residency somewhere between the Blue's and the Misty's. There, you spend a few hundred years, both intercepting / interceding Morgoths agents of influence, and fostering the latecomers. See if you can make a difference in the numbers of men that were wooed and allied into Morgoth's service.

Build up ranks of Avari and humans. Migrate en masse west over the Blue mountains. Claim squatter's rights in Himlad or other East Beleriand tracts. Attack massively at once, blowing it all as soon as possible, before the lies of M start nibbling at the edges of your society. Keep fingers crossed. Buy funeral insurance.

[Kuruharan]

Head east of the Blue Mnts and set up an initial residency somewhere between the Blue's and the Misty's. There, you spend a few hundred years, both intercepting / interceding Morgoths agents of influence, and fostering the latecomers. See if you can make a difference in the numbers of men that were wooed and allied into Morgoth's service.

Actually, that might not be such a mad idea. However, you'd have to be wary of the humans because some of them might be Morgoth's servants already. I think the greatest danger to this scheme would be internal revolt.

Build up ranks of Avari and humans. Migrate en masse west over the Blue mountains. Claim squatter's rights in Himlad or other East Beleriand tracts. Attack massively at once, blowing it all as soon as possible, before the lies of M start nibbling at the edges of your society. Keep fingers crossed. Buy funeral insurance.

I'm afraid the lies of Morgoth would already be nibbling well before this.

[drigel]

I'm afraid the lies of Morgoth would already be nibbling well before this.

The only counter would be to employ a Machiavellian tactic:

Insight a chronic nationalistic xenophobia in your subjects. Slay all strangers.

Harsh yes, but for the greater good.

[the guy who be short]

Originally Posted by drigel

Insight a chronic nationalistic xenophobia in your subjects. Slay all strangers.

Not really very Noldorin...

As for the perfect Noldorin Kingdom, quite simply, there could be no such thing. The entire Noldorin experiment was fated to fail. The best the Kingdom could hope for would be a temporary hidden haven such as Gondolin.

[drigel]

there could be no such thing.

quite true. In the "what could have been done differently" line of thought, the only variable I can see that could have been adjusted would have been mankind. Could there have been more reaching out to them earlier? And could have that made a difference in the numbers of those that he gathered? Were the deceits of Morgoth unassailable? Could there have been a pre-emptive strike against them?

Interesting