![]() |
![]() |
Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page |
|
![]() |
#1 |
A Mere Boggart
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: under the bed
Posts: 4,737
![]() ![]() |
I've often wondered if the colours had any significance but if I explore this too far I get tangled and things would become too difficult to explain with evidence from the texts, so here's my simple explanation
![]() Gandalf's 'Grey' I think may come quite literally from his appearance - he was the most well-travelled wizard that we know of, in terms of mixing with people in Middle earth, and his fame itself may have earned him a nickname. i also like to think that maybe his nickname may have arisen from his method of giving advice - he encourages those he talks to to think through the options and consequences, to consider the 'grey' areas, e.g. Frodo at first sees Gollum's survival as an issue with a clear answer, but Gandalf encourages him to see it another way. I think that Saruman's 'White' title comes from his position as head of the Istari - he is recognised as such by Cirdan on his arrival, and goes on to be head of the White Council. White would be an appropriate designation for the wizard who took this position as White could be said to symbolise Light. When Saruman breaks the Light to see what it is made from, he then becomes Saruman of Many Colours. Gandalf then is able to take or be given the title 'White' as it has in effect become free. As to why there are two 'Blue' wizards, I think possibly it is that Tolkien simply did not designate them separate colours as they were something of an afterthought in the writing process - though 'Blue' is a good choice of title for two wizards who effectively disappeared off into 'the blue yonder'. And I think 'Brown' is appropriate for Radagast, as he is close to nature, and brown is suitably 'earthy'. On the Encyclopedia of Arda site it interstingly quotes the Old English word 'rudugast', meaning 'brown spirit' as a possible origin though it does point out that there is no evidence for this.
__________________
Gordon's alive!
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#2 |
Shade of Carn Dūm
|
I suppose if Alatar took Pallando 'as a friend' they would be on the same terms, or rank.
I don't think the Valar and the others at that council could make too much of an assumption of rank, at least not beyond any foresight. If the original Istari were Curumo and Alatar, Then if you did nto know much about them, it might go like this: Sauruman The White Alatar the Blue (These could be interchangable) Gandalf the Grey Radagast the Brown and ideally, how i would think anyway, is that Pallando might not have been given 'wizard powers', but perhaps a little like if gandalf had a Frodo Clone he went everywhere with. So essentially he is on Alatar's rank (Blue), but I would think he would be lesser than Alatar. But then Cirdan said: Sauruman (White) Gandalf (Grey) Radagast (Brown) Alatar (Blue) Pallando (Blue) And of course then later Cirdan and Galadriel said Gandalf was really stronger, and Sauruman was cast out, and Alatar and Pallando dissappeared, and I guess Radagst forgot he might go back to Aman, or he didnt want to, or he got in an argument with an Eagle.So i think the idea was to have the wizards on the same rank, that is, working together with no one of them taking domination, yet their 'personal' intrests seperated them. Also I was thinking, did the wizards (all five) only meet together, like formally, at that council in Aman? Because if they each showed up at different times, and spread out across ME, they would be a bit long distance for business partners. ________ Naruto forums Last edited by Elu Ancalime; 03-03-2011 at 10:47 PM. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3 | ||
Eagle of the Star
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sarmisegethuza
Posts: 1,058
![]() |
Quote:
EDIT: I found this interesting note in Quendi and Eldar, HoME XI: Quote:
Last edited by Raynor; 02-25-2006 at 08:31 AM. |
||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4 |
Shade of Carn Dūm
|
I thought it to be thier position to the Great Journey: Moriquendi (mori literally meaning black) being elves who did not see the Two Trees, though usually assumed for Avari, could be Black. The High Elves, Caliquendi, (Light approx. White), saw the Light of the Trees, and made it to Valinor. The Grey-Elves were those that accepted the Journey, but did not go directly to Valinor, (the Sindar, elves under Thingol Greymantle)
________ Lincoln continental mark v Last edited by Elu Ancalime; 03-03-2011 at 10:50 PM. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#5 |
Psyche of Prince Immortal
|
the colours could repersent the Valar they served at first
__________________
Love doesn't blow up and get killed.
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#6 |
Shade of Carn Dūm
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Washington, D. C., USA
Posts: 299
![]() |
I tend to think that it is very likely that we are all trying to read more into Tolkien's choice of colors than is actually there. I think the colors were chosen spontaneously. That is, their colors were meant to be strictly a "psychological" impact on the reader. "White" has it's impact on the reader as pure and unstained, PERFECT. "Grey" is inherently undefined, transitional, mobile yet natural, unassuming. "Blue" is mysterious, ("why is the sky blue, Daddy?) infinite like the sky, angelic. "Brown" implies Nature, forests and fields, trees and soil. I guess I don't think the Valar chose the colors, Tolkien did, as he wrote.
__________________
But all the while I sit and think of times there were before, I listen for returning feet and voices at the door. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
|
|
![]() |