Ooh la la, Lúthien...

[Nuranar]

This is indeed a fascinating topic. I wish I could offer my dos pesetas, but alas I have not done the reading I feel necessary to have an adequate understanding. I do want to respond to something, however.

Squatter, your post was excellent; I both enjoyed and appreciated your insightful and sensitive exposition. I just had a quick comment about one thing:

However, the Bible also says

quote:
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Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love,
I have become as sounding brass or a clanging cymbal
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(I Corinthians XIII:1)
All loveless states and actions are as nothing, and Tolkien has extrapolated this in his portrayal of Beren and Lúthien, although he has almost certainly stepped beyond the bounds of official doctrine in so doing. (boldface mine)

I agree; no matter how "good" or noble or beneficial the action, without love it means absolutely nothing. The love that Paul writes of here, however, is probably not the love that existed between Beren and Lúthien. (I used an online lexicon available here.

In New Testament Greek, I found two different kinds of love: agape and phileo. Phileo is defined as:

1. to love: to approve of; to like; sanction; to treat affectionately or kindly, to welcome, befriend
2. to show signs of love: to kiss
3. to be fond of doing: be wont, use to do

I would say romantic love falls in this category. It is the root from whence comes philadelphia, brotherly love.

By contrast, agape means:

brotherly love, affection, good will, love, benevolence

This is the love found in I Corinthians 13:1. From scanning a lexicon, I see that Paul (the author of I Corinthians) uses it almost exclusively to refer to the love of God, of Christ Jesus, and of the Spirit.

From various sermons and Bible studies I had thought there was a third kind of love. I have e-mailed my father (he has studied NT Greek), and if he confirms I will update this post.

I really appreciate your post, Squatter; I just wanted to clarify that small point. Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]