Misc. Questions

[Gorthaur the Cruel]

Originally Posted by Joy

Celebrimbor made the 3 rings and gave them to Gil-galad, Cirdan, and to Galadriel.

At the time that Sauron had made his ring, even though they were apart, they could sense the power of his and took theirs off. They also had means of Osanwe Kenta. They could have spoken this way.

No no. Clebrimbor along with the smithies(under the influence of Sauron) revolted against the rulership of Celeborn & Galadriel resulting to Galadriel's departure for Lorinand. At this time Celebrimbor began secretly making the Three & Sauron went to Mordor to fulfill his scheme. By the time Sauron finished the One & began saying the deplorable rhyme, it was implied that the Elves became aware of them & so Celebrimbor went to Lorinand (after finding out Sauron's deception) to take counsel with Galadriel & it was at this time that she recieved Nenya. That would mean there were other three bearers of Three who "sensed" Sauron's deception.

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

Well, there are roughly 103 years of which we have no account. The three were made in S.A. c.1590; Celebrimbor discovered Sauron's plot in S.A. c.1600, and the Three were hidden in S.A. 1693, so I can see how this question arises. Legolas and Joy have given you the best answer that the books can supply, though. I can't claim to have made an exhaustive study, but I'm fairly sure that never in any of the writings available to us does Tolkien mention by name any keepers of the Three before Gil-galad, Círdan and Galadriel. This includes the published letters, the early drafts of LotR and all post-LotR versions of the Silmarillion. What Tolkien does say, however, is that:

Throughout the Third Age the guardianship of the Three Rings was known only to those who possessed them. But in the end it became known that they had been held at first by the three greatest of the Eldar: Gil-galad, Galdriel and Círdan.

[The Return of the King, Appendix B, p.365 (first edition). My italics]

As for the discovery of the plot, the Tale of Years has this to say:

c.1600 Sauron forges the One Ring in Orodruin. He completes the Barad-dûr. Celebrimbor perceives the designs of Sauron.

[Ibid, p.364. My italics]

Those are the facts as matters stand. My guess is that Tolkien means what he says and that the Three were given first to the named parties. Note that no mention is made of when this first giving took place: it could easily have been when the Rings were hidden, which would only mean that Celebrimbor held the Three in his charge for just over a century. Nor is there any particular reason why at first the rings should have been given to different people rather than being stored in a treasury: they were separated in order to make it more difficult for Sauron to acquire them. Since Celebrimbor was the ruler of Eregion, the smiths thereof being subject to him as such, it does not seem altogether unlikely that he should have been the Rings' original keeper. This would explain why in the Tale of Years it is he who is specifically mentioned as the uncoverer of the plot. Also it seems unlikely that he would entrust the Three to anyone but the named keepers once Sauron's plan became known to him, so the questionable period is only ten years: a short enough time for an Elf. If there were any anonymous early keepers then there is no record of them. In history, that is as close as one can get to being nobody.

[Thinlómien]

Well this is a stupid question, but did Maedhros have red hair? Is it mentioned anywhere? I've always imagined him with dark hair, but every single piece of artwork about him shows him with red hair. So do these artists know more than I do, or do they just have a different picture about his haircolor?

[Joy]

Maedhros was nicknamed "Russandol," or "copper top" by his mother Nerdanel.

[Joy]

Speaking of red-heads, it seems that the twins Amrod and Amras were red-headed also.

Amras's mother name was Ambarussa - which means "russet-top" Amrod's mother name was Ambarto.

According to The History of Middle Earth, Vol. XII, The Peoples of Middle Earth, the twins may even have been identical. Below is an extended quotation which reveals Tolkien’s explanation for their names, which were originally Ambarto (which was then changed again to Umbarto and back again) and Ambarussa.


"These two names of [the] twins (i-Wenyn) were evidently meant to begin similarly. Ambarussa ‘top-russet’ must have referred to hair: the first and last of Nerdanel’s children had the reddish hair of her kin. Around the name Ambarto [> Umbarto] - which one might expect to begin with an element of the same sense at (Ambarussa) - much legend and discussion gathered. The most authentic seems to be thus:

The two twins were both red-haired. Nerdanel gave them both the name Ambarussa - for they were much alike and remained so while they lived. When Fëanor begged that their names should at least be different Nerdanel looked strange, and after a while said: ‘Then let one be called [Ambarto >] Umbarto, but which, time will decide.’

[HerenIstarion]

Older thread: Redheads of Middle Earth

[Gorthaur the Cruel]

Another Question:

How did the One Ring reach all the way back to the Gladden Fields?