Burning Bodies like the heathen kings

[Ar-Pharazon]

The Heathen kings are in referrence to the beginnings of men in the first age. When men came to be the only beings they were in contact with were the dark elves and minions of Morgoth. Times were tough and they were tormented by Morgoth, where they developed their fear of the "gift of death". Many humans became evil and aligned themselves with Morgoth, but not all.

In the Silmarillion many groups of humans flee over the mountain ranges dividing the east and west and encounter the Noldor and the grey elves. They enter into their service and ally themselves with them in the war against Morgoth, they become known as the Edain.

After the war of Wrath and the fall of Morgoth, these Edain are given Numenor and are then known as the Dunedain. During the reign of Numenor they develop the ability to keep the flesh from degrading after death and the dead are then entombed rather then burned. The armies of Numenor then returns to middle earth and conquer many of the Heathen Kingdoms of men which were the descendants of the men that did not become the Edain and are loyal to Sauron.

Their is not much else really said about the Heathen Kings except that the people of middle earth viewed the people of Numenor as godlike and lords of men. So what Denethor is referring to is the time before Numenor was at its apex and it seems implied that man burned their dead

~Ar

[alatar]

Just a thought: was burning the dead seen as a way to keep the body from becoming an undead tool or plaything of the enemy - wight, zombie, ghost, etc?

[Holbytlass]

Originally Posted by alatar

Just a thought: was burning the dead seen as a way to keep the body from becoming an undead tool or plaything of the enemy - wight, zombie, ghost, etc?

Originally Posted by piosenniel

It is Gandalf in the chapter, The Pyre of Denethor from The Return of the King who speaks of heathen kings. And he defines them as being those under the Domination of the Dark Lord who slew themselves in pride and despair along with their kin.

No, seeing how the 'enemy' was Sauron and they were under his dominion. In that instance, I would think that Sauron would see cremation as disloyal and a betrayal, if he so chooses to use the dead as a tool.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by alatar

Just a thought: was burning the dead seen as a way to keep the body from becoming an undead tool or plaything of the enemy - wight, zombie, ghost, etc?

That's quite possible, especially if they had any dealings with Elves and had picked up ideas from them which had developed into their own superstitions. There is a passage in Morgoth's Ring which describes how the 'houseless fea' could easily take over another person as it sought a body; I think the passage also says that Sauron had means of using a houseles fea in this way. I thought I had quoted this on another thread but I've just remembered that the post I wrote was swallowed by the 'net. I shall look it up though...

[Firefoot]

I wonder if the Wild Men burned their dead, then.

And I wonder if it was just the heathen kings who burned, or if it was everyone in that culture (though presumably most people would burn after death...).

[Alcarillo]

Originally Posted by Firefoot

I wonder if the Wild Men burned their dead, then.

And I wonder if it was just the heathen kings who burned, or if it was everyone in that culture (though presumably most people would burn after death...).

And all you need is some wood. Digging a grave takes time and effort. Burning the dead is surely more efficient for Wild Men out in the forests, where plenty of wood is to be found.

If Denethor had not said heathen kings, then I might've assumed that kings might have been buried, and possibly embalmed, like the Pharaohs of Egypt. Kings might've been given special treatment. But it seems otherwise . . .