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Laconic Loreman
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Thank you for that wonderful post Squatter.
There has been always something else about Denethor too, which I think is a reason for Denethor's dislike on Gandalf. Eomer was on the right track, now just needs a bit of explaining. Quote:
I would also like to mention Theoden in this situation. Tolkien establishes many connections between Theoden and Denethor. I wonder if he's trying to show us the difference between a King and a Steward? Or just show the differences between the two? The key figure in both (in their downfall and their rise) is Gandalf. Both Denethor and Theoden lost their wife a while back. They lost their son in heir. They are watching their kingdom on the verge of destruction. They are both put under the power of their respected enemies. Theoden is under Saruman's control (thanks to Grima) and Denethor loses in his fight with Sauron totally losing his mind. However where they are different is Theoden is able to rise above all his hardships and win glory, and die in glory. In LOTR we see his low point, and he rises up to his high point. Denethor we see his slow decline until he loses his mind and burns himself. I think the main reason for Theoden's rise, and Denethor's downfall is...Gandalf. Theoden although he is a king, he shows humility and accepts Gandalf's advice. He listens to Gandalf, on his way to Helm's Deep he even admits that now he's learned of Saruman's power Gandalf's words don't sound as good as they did in the Golden Hall, and he wishes he knew now what he knew then. However, Theoden still goes along with Gandalf's advice, intrusting his whole Kingdom into Gandalf. Denethor on the opposite hand doesn't take anything that Gandalf advises. They are constantly butting heads. Denethor sees himself as ruler of Gondor, and doesn't care for anyone, or anything else.
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Fenris Penguin
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