No Living Man

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

I might be wrong, but I'm seeing a fair element of luck in the matter.

Ah, the good ol' free will versus predestination. Tolkien already showed that he is not opposed to predestination, seeing as how Frodo and Bilbo were *meant* to have the Ring. So does that mean the Eowyn and Merry were born with an utter lack of free will? Or does it mean that through an extraordinary set of circumstances, their free will meshed perfectly with what Eru wanted? Or does it mean that it's all just pure dumb luck without the slightest hint of divine intervention?

The prophecy in itself declares the latter invalid, or maybe it doesn't. Was Glorfindel seeing what would happen, or what, given the right pure dumb luck moments, could happen?

But only someone who wasn't a man would do so.

True, in the 3rd Age. Elves knew that it was not their battle, and so involved themselves (with some exceptions) only to defend themselves and their realms. Dwarves are greedy and so only defended themselves, their kin, and their realms (with some exceptions). The 3rd Age was the time of Men. No questions asked.

But why, Saucie, would nobody (ignoring Earnur) try for a nice little throwing knife stab-wound before then? Merry had a dagger! It could have been aero-dynamic... Kidding, kidding... at least mostly. But in the previous Ages, why wouldn't someone who wasn't a man try?

Fea

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Fea

But in the previous Ages, why wouldn't someone who wasn't a man try?

Lack of opportunity, I should imagine.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Not owning the references I need, and not being inclined to google it to death, I'll leave your thoughts of opportunity for someone else to poke at (perhaps see if it wiggles). However, this is not an aimless post, as I wanted to include this one thought: where no opportunity arises, don't many characters/people make their own?

I imagine that if I wanted someone dead badly enough, rather than waiting for Fate to show me the crystal clear path and give me a swift kick down it, I'd [plan carefully first and then] just do it! Tosh to lack of opportunity... if you want something badly enough, you go after it. I think that's a law of life somewhere... I've a vague memory of that being called ambition.

Fea

[The Saucepan Man]

Fair enough. I shall re-phrase my answer.

Lack of opportunity and/or ambition.

[Hot, crispy nice hobbit]

Now this may sound beside the point, but no-one seemed to have addressed the question of why no arrows could harm the Ringwraiths... Gandalf himself said that to Legolas after the elf shot down the flying beast that one of the Nazgul was riding on.

How queer: Aragorn said that any blade that pierces the old Witchking will perish. He probably had references to past instances where the old ghoul had been stabbed. Unfortunately though, none of those blades that had pierced the WK before had managed to wound him to any serious degree. Makes you wonder how many times the WK have been sticked before...

Now, given another situation where some Dunedain or Elf tried to assassinate our old zombie with an arrow through the eye (or throat for that matter). Can our cloaked chump be downed by an arrow? Nope; Gandalf said so. On the other hand, a little thrown Westerness dagger will work...

"Hinder me? Thou fool. No puny sword may hinder me! I should know... I got sliced 666 times... " - the Witchking to Dernhelm (Eowyn).

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Fea

But in the previous Ages, why wouldn't someone who wasn't a man try?

I think the reason nobody tried (and we don't know for certain that nobody tried) to kill the WK in an earlier age may again have something to do with his reputation. If he was a figure who many had already tried to despatch, and failed, then it is easy to imagine why there would not be many willing to try again. And it is likely that if anybody did try to despatch him then they would not live to tell the tale. In addition, it would be likely that the WK was difficult figure to locate, let alone to find in isolation without his fellow Nazgul or minions.

Far off yet is his doom, and not by the hand of man will he fall

Words such as those which Glorfindel speaks might be enough to scare anybody off from attempting this feat, and note that he also says that his doom is far off. If anybody believed what Glorfindel had said, then they might be assumed to also think that it would not be worth the attempt if the WK's doom was 'far off'.

This makes me wonder whether Glorfindel was right to say what he did. Did he save lives by warning people not to attempt this? Or did he only serve to add to the fearsome reputation of the WK?

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

This makes me wonder whether Glorfindel was right to say what he did. Did he save lives by warning people not to attempt this? Or did he only serve to add to the fearsome reputation of the WK?

Both. Lives were saved, depending on whether or not you want to include the lives that the Witch King took because he was able to. It also boosted his bad rep, because picture this:

davem is Glorfindel. Dave says that a newbie isn't worth wasting your time over. He's a bad poster, and reading his stuff will only lower your own IQ. When davem gives this reputation (think lil green boxes), it gives un-named newbie a reeeeally bad rep. That's because davem has a high reputation. A praise from the praiseworthy, so to speak, only opposite. If davindel says that King Newbie is bad, a lot of Downer/MElings are going to hear this, and avoid the newbie.

Now this is a good thing, in that nobody will be corrupted by said newbie, but it's a bad thing because it means that nobody will bother setting the newbie on the straight and narrow (which for the Wikkie is a nice jab to the knee), because we are too busy following davem's statement to think for ourselves.

Did this make any sense, or did I just severely bungle the point I was trying to make?

Fea