The Trickster in LotR - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Lush · 03-02-2005, 01:40 PM

/because you have a built in choice between either funny or ambiguous. If it's not one, it's the other./

I do?

Hm. Sorry, can't quite understand.

I think that the above broken taboos still demonstrate a departure from the Trickster. An improvement even, if you will. Because the Trickster archetype is, from my understanding, meant to make us uncomfortable by its moral ambiguity. I don't see anyone doing just that in Middle Earth, except for maybe Gollum, but only up to a point (especially when I keep his death in mind).

Eowyn disobeys and the Hobbits wander into the Old Forest for specific reasons; Eowyn is out for death and glory and ends up slaying the Witchking in the process, the Hobbits are trying carrying a Ring that will decide the fate of the world. This isn't Trickster. There are echoes of Trickster, yes, of course, but I don't really see him there in his entirety.

And it's not that I'm saying that Tolkien had no sense of humour, but that it's markedly different from the kind of humour used in the Trickster myths I'm familiar with.

P.S. "Faust" is a great read. Though nobody has yet told me if there is any information on how Tolkien felt about Goethe. Any takers?

03-02-2005, 01:40 PM	#30
Lush Fair and Cold Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the big onion Posts: 1,770	/because you have a built in choice between either funny or ambiguous. If it's not one, it's the other./ I do? Hm. Sorry, can't quite understand. I think that the above broken taboos still demonstrate a departure from the Trickster. An improvement even, if you will. Because the Trickster archetype is, from my understanding, meant to make us uncomfortable by its moral ambiguity. I don't see anyone doing just that in Middle Earth, except for maybe Gollum, but only up to a point (especially when I keep his death in mind). Eowyn disobeys and the Hobbits wander into the Old Forest for specific reasons; Eowyn is out for death and glory and ends up slaying the Witchking in the process, the Hobbits are trying carrying a Ring that will decide the fate of the world. This isn't Trickster. There are echoes of Trickster, yes, of course, but I don't really see him there in his entirety. And it's not that I'm saying that Tolkien had no sense of humour, but that it's markedly different from the kind of humour used in the Trickster myths I'm familiar with. P.S. "Faust" is a great read. Though nobody has yet told me if there is any information on how Tolkien felt about Goethe. Any takers? __________________ ~The beginning is the word and the end is silence. And in between are all the stories. This is one of mine~