A question about Wizards - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Mankáno · 04-29-2002, 08:05 PM

The term wise was referred to the Istari ( the wizards) and the higuest among the Eldar (Elrond, Cirdan, Galadriel, probably Glorfindel).

There isn't much information about the Istari in either LOTR or the Silmarillion, there is a little more in Unfinished Tales.

there are some notes from Tolkien, not included in LOTR or the Silmarillion that refer to them.

Apparently there was a council of the Valar where they decided to send some Maiar to Middle Earth to help in the fight against Sauron.

But learning from past mistakes, the Valar decided that they couldn't use their powers or show themselves in all their majesty and beauty, but they had to gain the hearts and the minds of those opposed to Sauron by advices, and using their wisdom but not their powers.

It's known the Istari that arrived to Middle Earth around 1000, third age were five: Curumo (Curunir or Saruman), Allatar, Pallando, Aiwendil (Radagast) and Olorin (Gandalf).

Saruman was the first chosen and apparently he was a maia of Aule, Allatar and Pallando were related to Orome, Radagast to Yavannah and Gandalf to Manwe and Varda.

Saruman was the most powerful, at least in Middle earth, the reasons are not explained but when Saruman become evil, Gandalf took his place. It isn't clear in LOTR but knowing the history you understand what happened when Gandalf died fighting the Balrog, as a Maiar he couldn't die, his spirit left to Aman and he was sent back to finish his mission, but at this stage, he came with his powers, although he could only use them in extreme cases (like when he faced the Lord of the Nazgul in Minas Tirith). That's why Gandalf said he had forgotten many things he thought he knew and learned many things he had forgotten, and Aragorn said that he could travel faster than anyone else if he wanted to.

Sorry, a little off topic, but Saruman was corrupted, Radagast lost the sense of his mission and dedicated to animals, and the Blue wizards apparently went to the East with Saruman and never came back, it's not known what happened to them and they are not mentioned in LOTR or the Silmarillion except when Saruman refers to the 5 wizards.

They could have been more than 5, they only mention those who came to the North of Middle Earth, but there could have been more in other areas.

[ April 29, 2002: Message edited by: Mankáno ]

04-29-2002, 08:05 PM	#18
Mankáno Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Tirion Posts: 30	The term wise was referred to the Istari ( the wizards) and the higuest among the Eldar (Elrond, Cirdan, Galadriel, probably Glorfindel). There isn't much information about the Istari in either LOTR or the Silmarillion, there is a little more in Unfinished Tales. there are some notes from Tolkien, not included in LOTR or the Silmarillion that refer to them. Apparently there was a council of the Valar where they decided to send some Maiar to Middle Earth to help in the fight against Sauron. But learning from past mistakes, the Valar decided that they couldn't use their powers or show themselves in all their majesty and beauty, but they had to gain the hearts and the minds of those opposed to Sauron by advices, and using their wisdom but not their powers. It's known the Istari that arrived to Middle Earth around 1000, third age were five: Curumo (Curunir or Saruman), Allatar, Pallando, Aiwendil (Radagast) and Olorin (Gandalf). Saruman was the first chosen and apparently he was a maia of Aule, Allatar and Pallando were related to Orome, Radagast to Yavannah and Gandalf to Manwe and Varda. Saruman was the most powerful, at least in Middle earth, the reasons are not explained but when Saruman become evil, Gandalf took his place. It isn't clear in LOTR but knowing the history you understand what happened when Gandalf died fighting the Balrog, as a Maiar he couldn't die, his spirit left to Aman and he was sent back to finish his mission, but at this stage, he came with his powers, although he could only use them in extreme cases (like when he faced the Lord of the Nazgul in Minas Tirith). That's why Gandalf said he had forgotten many things he thought he knew and learned many things he had forgotten, and Aragorn said that he could travel faster than anyone else if he wanted to. Sorry, a little off topic, but Saruman was corrupted, Radagast lost the sense of his mission and dedicated to animals, and the Blue wizards apparently went to the East with Saruman and never came back, it's not known what happened to them and they are not mentioned in LOTR or the Silmarillion except when Saruman refers to the 5 wizards. They could have been more than 5, they only mention those who came to the North of Middle Earth, but there could have been more in other areas. [ April 29, 2002: Message edited by: Mankáno ]