Battles of the late Third Age

[Kuruharan]

For example if a quick violent dash is needed, the greater strides of the towering Dunedain would give them an advantage over dwarves.

Actually, I do disagree with this. In a short charge the dwarves would have a lower center of gravity and with their greater strength they would have a much easier time of crashing into the enemy line and knocking their enemies to the ground and chopping them into itty bitty bits. They would not have to worry as much about the longer reach of some of their enemies because of the quality of their armor.

The Perisian Epigoni was still in an embryonic stage.

Ah, okay. I wasn’t sure about that.

[Rumil]

Hi All,

Eomer is definitely up next, but I think I need to type it up in Word and paste in later as the post seems to be turning complicated at the mo. Anyway, I thought Saurreg raised some nice points about Sarman's army. I agree that they showed some tactical sophistication, the pikes and trenches are exactly the right way to fend off cavalry as long as they're not outflanked.

I'm wondering if these pikemen were a) Dunlendings, and therefore allies of Saruman, probably led by their own cheiftains or b) troops maintained solely by Saruman. I think its revealing that at Helm's Deep the Dunlendings cry out in a 'foreign' language, but the ruffians at the scouring of the Shire certainly speak the common tongue. (In fact a very common tongue!). I wonder if Saruman recruited and trained a reasonably large number of men, perhaps instructing them in language as well as tactics. From these some may have been selected for spying duties up the Greenway, others trained as pikemen and some remained as Saruman's trusted gate guards. Perhaps some were even desceded from the old Gondorian garrison of Orthanc. Presumably Orthanc would always have had a garrison of some sort after its re-occupation by Saruman and a human force would have been more acceptable in case visitors dropped by, before the orcish army was revealed to the world.

Its also a big shame that we only get to see one of Saruman's 'underlings', Grima Wormtongue. There must have been 'generals' sent out with the army. From Grima, maybe we can conclude that although corrupted, they were certainly not without intellgence. I'd also imagine some sort of 'apprentice sorcerors' to set off the technically complex 'fires of Orthanc', though I'm getting ahead of myself here!

[Kuruharan]

troops maintained solely by Saruman...Perhaps some were even desceded from the old Gondorian garrison of Orthanc.

I think considering their weapons they would almost have to be Saruman's Own Pike Regiment. I always pictured them as being human. I never really considered where they came from. However, they were evidently not numerous because they are never mentioned again (although that is evidently where Jackson got the idea). Their lack of numbers as well as their equipment makes it appear to me that they were probably some of the old people of Isengard who had lived there for generations.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

[T]hey were probably some of the old people of Isengard who had lived there for generations. (Kuru)

I agree. As I recall the inhabitants of Isengard by the time it went under Saruman's stewardship had much Dunlendish blood.

[Saurreg]

I for one tend to think of the phalanx contigent as a unit of Dunlendings specially organized, equiped and trained to repel cavalry.

If memory serves (it seldom does now), the Dunlending has had contact with the Rohirrim and relationships between both people were a wee bit hostile. Thus if Saruman needed a human look in his army, the Dunlendings would be the best candidates. Or that was needed for the walled up tide of bad feelings to flow was a little push and Saruman could have done that. As Erkenbrand explained to the captives at the foot of Helmsdeep, they were misled by Saruman and I dare say it was due to their prolonged bias and hatred to the horse-tamers.

As for the equipment and tactics, both could have been bestowed upon by Saruman or not. Stephen Dando-Collins stated in his book Caesar's Legion" that when the Helvetii attacked, they made use of the Greek phalanx. A classic case of monkey see, monkey do. The dunlendings could also have done so, either from the memories of some elders who had seen phalanx in action or have heard stories of how moving pikes mowed down everything before it. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the longer the pike, the lesser chance a horseman can get to you and that if every pikemen cluster together and point their pike tips in the same direction and advance, the chances of sucess are much higher for say a lone naked fanatic with an axe.

That said, I will not discount the fact Saruman might have his orcs round up a motley crue and have them taken to him. He'll look at the bunch, stroke his beard and say,

"Alright then! You see those big sticks laying on the ground there? Yes, those. Now I want every single one of you to pick up a stick. No! Not those twigs at your feet! I meant THOSE sticks over there! Yes, good... Now I want you to form a rectangle, sixteen a column and ten per row. What's that Michael? You don't know what's a rectangle? Billy? You're confused between the difference columns and rows. Yer Valars... (Barks a curt command to a group of uruks chatting around the water dispenser, taps foot impatiently) Now that is what I want. Now do as the Uruks just did. No Paul, you don't need to go growling and beating your chest, just go line up! Ok! You are now in a rectangle. No Jason! You don't go around giving hi-fives and handshakes, we're not over yet! Now I want the first four rows to point the sharpened ends of your big sticks forwards. What's that Billy? You still... Nevermind! The first four rows start with Andy and ends with Mac! You see that Billy? That's the first four rows! Now the rest of you tilt your sticks a little forward. Yes good. What's that Mac? You cannot point your stick forward because you'll impale the man before you and you don't want to impale him because you're a nice guy! Ok, just hold your stick over his shoulder. There! Now I want all of you to walk slowly towards that uruk over there. Nice and slow! Don't run Andy! WALK! Yes! Yes! Good... Now when you see those big bad strawheads and their horses, this is what you do. You pick up your big stick, form a rectangle and walk towards the strawheads together. Understand? Capisch? Good! Any questions? What's that Jason? Yes, you can go congratulate yourselves now!"

[Rumil]

Eomer’s Battle

Our next battle, Eomer’s destruction of the Uruk-Hai, is in fact not much more than a skirmish, but gives us the opportunity to see the tactics of the Uruks and Rohirrim at a closer level.

Then with a great cry the Riders charged from the East; the red light gleamed on mail and spear

The precursors to this battle were the skirmishes at Sarn Gebir on the 23rd February 3019 and at Parth Galen on the 26th of February, where the Fellowship was broken. At Parth Galen we are shown a mixed company of ordinary orcs and Uruk-Hai, the Uruk-Hai belonging to Saruman, the orcs to Sauron and Moria. Boromir managed to slay about 20, Legolas and Gimli ‘many’. With the three hunters in hot pursuit the orcs set off across Rohan, though stopping briefly for an altercation between Ugluk and Gishnakh where another 5 were killed. They managed to outrun their pursuers. Interestingly, Legolas says

There is some will that lends speed to our foes and sets an unseen barrier before us

Evidence of Saruman’s ‘magic’?

Eventually Eomer’s eored of Rohirrim encountered them on the plains and managed to overtake and surround them just before they reached Fangorn forest.

The orcish forces consisted of Saruman’s Uruk-Hai under Ugluk, with Lugdush maybe second in command. They carried short broad bladed swords, yew bows with long-shafted arrows, shields with the white hand device, chainmail and helms with an ‘S’ rune. The orcs of the eye were led by Grishnakh, they were generally short and stocky in comparison with the Uruk-Hai. Additionally there was a contingent of Moria orcs who were smaller than both the groups above and were not happy operating in daylight. The orcs had bows with black feathered arrows, shields and scimitars and may have been armoured. There were also some ‘Snaga’ scouts armed with bows. Darts are mentioned, this may indicate javelins or alternatively war-darts, maybe similar to the Late Roman martiobarbuli. In total there were around 200 orcs remaining by the time of the battle. Previously there were around 100 Moria orcs, 80 Uruk-Hai and 40 Mordor orcs and a few snaga scouts. In addition, of course, Merry and Pippin!

The Rohirrim consisted of Eomer’s Marshall’s eored of 120 cavalry. They rode grey horses with braided manes, carried tall ash spears with bright spearheads, painted shields and long swords and wore burnished mail coats, some carried bows and fired grey-fletched arrows. The riders themselves were tall with blond braided hair. Eomer wore a white horsetail crest and rode a horse called Firefoot.

The battlefield was around a hillock just three furlongs from the eaves of Fangorn, bounded on the East by the river Entwash.

The battle took place during the night of the 28th February and the morning of the 29th. After harassing the orcs with bowshot and surrounding them on the knoll, the Rohirrim settled in to degrade the morale of their opponents by small actions, sensibly waiting until morning to launch an all out attack. They cut off a group that tried to flee to the forest, shot some, infiltrated the camp to kill some more and lit watchfires in a ring around the knoll. Orc morale was distinctly shaky and rapidly became worse, though the Uruk-Hai were less impressed. At this point Grishnakh attempted to escape with Merry and Pippin but was swiftly spotted, shot and speared.

Ugluk was still hopeful, however, as he knew of another force of orcs under Mauhur waiting to support him in Fangorn. I’d guess that these were Uruk-hai but probably not very numerous, maybe 50-odd? Mauhur and his ‘lads’ may have been part of the missing Uruk battalion from the 1st Battle of Isen (see previous page), though Ugluk could not have been. Mauhur attacked, but Eomer sent a detachment which successfully dealt with the problem.

At dawn, with further degradation of orcish morale, the Rohirrim charged from the east (therefore with the sun in the eyes of the orcs), the riders singing and the horses neighing. The orcs responded by firing their remaining arrows, the Rohirrim passed up the knoll, wheeled, charged again and broke the orcs who were hunted down individually. Ugluk and a group of Uruk Hai formed a wedge and attempted to break through to the forest, at which Eomer dismounted and killed Ugluk in hand to hand combat. The orcs were utterly destroyed but the Rohirrim lost 12 horses and 15 men.

So ended the raid, and no news of it came ever back either to Mordor or to Isengard; but the smoke of the burning rose high to heaven and was seen by many watchful eyes

Some points which struck me included; the danger of a combined operation between Sauron and Saruman for either party if the ring had indeed been found; Saruman’s ‘magic’ coming into play; Eomer’s use of almost ‘guerilla warfare’ style tactics to damage orcish morale; the fact that Ugluk knew about Mauhur’s presence and the discipline of the Uruk Hai, who withstood 2 charges then tried a fighting withdrawal. Any comments on these?

Also, a link to the relevant chapter of Estelyn's fantasic Chapter-by-Chapter discussion

The Uruk-Hai

[Kuruharan]

First important point to note is that the Rohirrim were heavy enough to ride over a clustered body of troops, something not all horses or cavalry could be made to do, although the orcs may not have been "formed up" as such.