What are the Two Towers? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Boromir88 · 01-21-2005, 03:08 PM

Yes basically any combination could make sense. Especially Eomer's.

Where TTT: Book one, deals with Aragorn and all against Orthanc, and ends in Orthanc.

TTT: Book Two, ends with Cirith Ungol.

To even get things more complicated. I found many parallels between the two Amon's. (Amon Hen and Amon Sul). For that information check here.

Is it possible that Tolkien again is trying to draw parallels between the closings of TTT Book One and Book Two? Isengard and Cirith Ungol?

Elladan and Elrohir · 01-21-2005, 04:29 PM

I've always understood them to be Orthanc and Cirith Ungol, just because that's where the story takes you, and that's what Tolkien said.

But I'm beginning to think it could be Minas Tirith and Barad-dur. After all, in Book II, Chapter X, the chapter that can be considered the prelude to TTT, Frodo looks from Amon Hen and eventually focuses on Minas Tirith, and the greater and stronger tower set against it. This has been erroneously identified as Minas Morgul by at least one person in this thread, but it is clearly Barad-dur. So in that chapter, the Two Towers are clearly MT and BD.

We must keep in mind that Book Three is Secondary Action and Book Four is Primary Action (the Ringbearers and the Quest proper). Thus, especially with the chapters dealing with Faramir, I can see how The Two Towers could refer to Minas Tirith and Barad-dur.

But by no means have I reached a conclusion on this. At this point, my top five picks are:
1) Isengard and Cirith Ungol
2) Minas Tirith and Barad-dur
3) Isengard and Minas Morgul
4) Isengard and Barad-dur
5) Minas Tirith and Minas Morgul

But I am willing to be convinced, if anybody has anything I haven't thought about yet.

Finwe-89 · 01-22-2005, 06:08 AM

Wow, even years after Tolkien wrote these more then great books, there are still mysteries that no one understands or knows.

Ok, well, I think like the most that the two towers are Orthanc and Barad-Dûr. What else should it be. Ok in the movie ( yes the movie can be different) Sarumans said: ''Who now can stand against the connection of the two towers of Isengard? And Mordor?'' Ok something like that. But I might be wrong. It has been a long time I've read the books. But what else should it be? I don't think Saruman means his tower and the tower or Cirth-Ungol.

Eomer of the Rohirrim · 01-22-2005, 09:43 AM

Well, within the context of the film, I guess that's bulletproof.

The Only Real Estel · 01-22-2005, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Ok, well, I think like the most that the two towers are Orthanc and Barad-Dûr. What else should it be. Ok in the movie ( yes the movie can be different) Sarumans said: ''Who now can stand against the connection of the two towers of Isengard? And Mordor?'' Ok something like that. But I might be wrong. It has been a long time I've read the books. But what else should it be? I don't think Saruman means his tower and the tower or Cirth-Ungol

Quote:

Well, within the context of the film, I guess that's bulletproof

Yes, it is pretty clear-cut that Saruman was talking about Orthanc & Barad-Dur in the movies. But that is the movies & PJ himself has said that they simply chose to interpret the 'Two Towers' that way because he thought that would work the best for his audience.

Of course Tolkien might have meant it that way also, but it is less likely.

Finwe-89 · 01-23-2005, 11:25 AM

Barad-Dûr and Orthanc, because those two towers are the biggest and most important ones. Barad-Dûr = Sauron's Eye Orthanc = Saruman and his army of Uruk-hai. Cirith-Ungol doesn't have a real purpose, that's just a watchtower for Mordor so they can keep a eye for enemies like Gondor

Eomer of the Rohirrim · 01-23-2005, 12:24 PM

Orthanc is smaller and far less important than Minas Tirith. So even if it was regarding such traits, that would not make sense.

It's not set in stone at all, at least we should all infer that much.

01-21-2005, 04:29 PM	#2
Elladan and Elrohir Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Halls of Mandos Posts: 332	I've always understood them to be Orthanc and Cirith Ungol, just because that's where the story takes you, and that's what Tolkien said. But I'm beginning to think it could be Minas Tirith and Barad-dur. After all, in Book II, Chapter X, the chapter that can be considered the prelude to TTT, Frodo looks from Amon Hen and eventually focuses on Minas Tirith, and the greater and stronger tower set against it. This has been erroneously identified as Minas Morgul by at least one person in this thread, but it is clearly Barad-dur. So in that chapter, the Two Towers are clearly MT and BD. We must keep in mind that Book Three is Secondary Action and Book Four is Primary Action (the Ringbearers and the Quest proper). Thus, especially with the chapters dealing with Faramir, I can see how The Two Towers could refer to Minas Tirith and Barad-dur. But by no means have I reached a conclusion on this. At this point, my top five picks are: 1) Isengard and Cirith Ungol 2) Minas Tirith and Barad-dur 3) Isengard and Minas Morgul 4) Isengard and Barad-dur 5) Minas Tirith and Minas Morgul But I am willing to be convinced, if anybody has anything I haven't thought about yet. __________________ "If you're referring to the incident with the dragon, I was barely involved. All I did was give your uncle a little nudge out of the door." THE HOBBIT - IT'S COMING

01-22-2005, 06:08 AM	#3
Finwe-89 Wight Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In Lotholorien, looking in the mirror that shows that there is still hope for life... Posts: 84	Wow, even years after Tolkien wrote these more then great books, there are still mysteries that no one understands or knows. Ok, well, I think like the most that the two towers are Orthanc and Barad-Dûr. What else should it be. Ok in the movie ( yes the movie can be different) Sarumans said: ''Who now can stand against the connection of the two towers of Isengard? And Mordor?'' Ok something like that. But I might be wrong. It has been a long time I've read the books. But what else should it be? I don't think Saruman means his tower and the tower or Cirth-Ungol. __________________ Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum- ishi krimpatul... Beware: Don't speak this loud when you're alone in the dark... Unless you really want it... But don't say I didn't warn you...

01-22-2005, 09:43 AM	#4
Eomer of the Rohirrim Auspicious Wraith Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 4,859	Well, within the context of the film, I guess that's bulletproof. __________________ Los Ingobernables de Harlond

01-23-2005, 11:25 AM	#6
Finwe-89 Wight Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In Lotholorien, looking in the mirror that shows that there is still hope for life... Posts: 84	Barad-Dûr and Orthanc, because those two towers are the biggest and most important ones. Barad-Dûr = Sauron's Eye Orthanc = Saruman and his army of Uruk-hai. Cirith-Ungol doesn't have a real purpose, that's just a watchtower for Mordor so they can keep a eye for enemies like Gondor __________________ Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum- ishi krimpatul... Beware: Don't speak this loud when you're alone in the dark... Unless you really want it... But don't say I didn't warn you...

01-23-2005, 12:24 PM	#7
Eomer of the Rohirrim Auspicious Wraith Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 4,859	Orthanc is smaller and far less important than Minas Tirith. So even if it was regarding such traits, that would not make sense. It's not set in stone at all, at least we should all infer that much. __________________ Los Ingobernables de Harlond

01-21-2005, 03:08 PM	#1
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,521	Yes basically any combination could make sense. Especially Eomer's. Where TTT: Book one, deals with Aragorn and all against Orthanc, and ends in Orthanc. TTT: Book Two, ends with Cirith Ungol. To even get things more complicated. I found many parallels between the two Amon's. (Amon Hen and Amon Sul). For that information check here. Is it possible that Tolkien again is trying to draw parallels between the closings of TTT Book One and Book Two? Isengard and Cirith Ungol?