Ruin of Doriath - Húrin in Nargothrond - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Aiwendil · 12-13-2004, 02:46 PM

Looking back at §15 I think "Yet" is fine - the sense is slightly different since we have eliminated from this point "and long he bore with Hurin."

About the Dragon-helm: I must say I really don't think we would be justified in having it given to Hurin. The story projected in the note is completely different from the story told in WH. The new lord of the note is neither Hardang nor Daruin, and to interpret the note as referring to one of them is to force a meaning onto it that it doesn't have. Why would Daruin give the Helm to Hurin, anyway? One could imagine some reason - perhaps it is a gesture of scorn, like Hurin's gift of the gold to Thingol, or perhaps Daruin desires to be rid of any reminders of Turin and the house of Hador. But either of these stories - or any other - is an invention. Clearly no such motive was present in the note - before the development of Hardang and his party, there would be no reason for the new lord not to give the helm to Hurin, even if "the Halethrim do not wish any more to become enmeshed in the shadow of his kin."

Moreover, if Tolkien really had retained the idea that the Dragon-helm was given to Hurin, one would very much expect it to turn up in the outlines for the continuation of the story - and it does not.

Other than this issue, I think we're done with this section.

12-13-2004, 02:46 PM	#19
Aiwendil Late Istar Join Date: Mar 2001 Posts: 2,224	Looking back at §15 I think "Yet" is fine - the sense is slightly different since we have eliminated from this point "and long he bore with Hurin." About the Dragon-helm: I must say I really don't think we would be justified in having it given to Hurin. The story projected in the note is completely different from the story told in WH. The new lord of the note is neither Hardang nor Daruin, and to interpret the note as referring to one of them is to force a meaning onto it that it doesn't have. Why would Daruin give the Helm to Hurin, anyway? One could imagine some reason - perhaps it is a gesture of scorn, like Hurin's gift of the gold to Thingol, or perhaps Daruin desires to be rid of any reminders of Turin and the house of Hador. But either of these stories - or any other - is an invention. Clearly no such motive was present in the note - before the development of Hardang and his party, there would be no reason for the new lord not to give the helm to Hurin, even if "the Halethrim do not wish any more to become enmeshed in the shadow of his kin." Moreover, if Tolkien really had retained the idea that the Dragon-helm was given to Hurin, one would very much expect it to turn up in the outlines for the continuation of the story - and it does not. Other than this issue, I think we're done with this section.