Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes... - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

davem · 11-15-2004, 02:44 AM

I suppose the question is what is they're 'relationship' to the running years'? Legolas states that under the Sun all things change, but I think there's a (subtle) difference between being aware of change & being aware of millenia, centuries, years, months, days, hours, minutes & seconds. In short, mortals would invent clocks, Elves wouldn't. We're talking about a kind of flowing, like the tide coming in & out, or the endless round of the seasons - spring to summer to autumn to winter.

This is what I get from Legolas' original words, time experienced as a kind of 'circular' or 'spiral' process rather than a 'linear' one. Its a question of which kind of perception is natural to them. For instance, we don't experience a multi dimensional space time, even though we live in one, because our brains don't work that way. We can understand that multi dimensional space-time mathematically, even attempt to visualise it. So, we can relate to it & make use of the idea scientifically, but its not how we think or experience reality.

My understanding of Legolas' 'do not' is that he's saying 'We can understand what you mean by 'time', but it means something different to us.' 'Need not' implies that the Elves are basically experiencing time in the same way as mortals, but being so long lived they just ignore its passing.

So, is 'need not' more accurate? I think that depends on how'close' Elves are to us - are they simply extremely long lived 'humans' or are they different not just biologically, but spiritually & (specifically in this case) mentally?

11-15-2004, 02:44 AM	#24
davem Illustrious Ulair Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties Posts: 4,240	I suppose the question is what is they're 'relationship' to the running years'? Legolas states that under the Sun all things change, but I think there's a (subtle) difference between being aware of change & being aware of millenia, centuries, years, months, days, hours, minutes & seconds. In short, mortals would invent clocks, Elves wouldn't. We're talking about a kind of flowing, like the tide coming in & out, or the endless round of the seasons - spring to summer to autumn to winter. This is what I get from Legolas' original words, time experienced as a kind of 'circular' or 'spiral' process rather than a 'linear' one. Its a question of which kind of perception is natural to them. For instance, we don't experience a multi dimensional space time, even though we live in one, because our brains don't work that way. We can understand that multi dimensional space-time mathematically, even attempt to visualise it. So, we can relate to it & make use of the idea scientifically, but its not how we think or experience reality. My understanding of Legolas' 'do not' is that he's saying 'We can understand what you mean by 'time', but it means something different to us.' 'Need not' implies that the Elves are basically experiencing time in the same way as mortals, but being so long lived they just ignore its passing. So, is 'need not' more accurate? I think that depends on how'close' Elves are to us - are they simply extremely long lived 'humans' or are they different not just biologically, but spiritually & (specifically in this case) mentally? __________________ “Everything was an object. If you killed a dwarf you could use it as a weapon – it was no different to other large heavy objects."