Regarding Gríma and Éowyn - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

The Only Real Estel · 07-16-2004, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Eowyn could wield a sword and shield. Grima hadn't fought for a long time. This gives her an edge up in terms of strength.

Grima kept up by doing hundreds of pushups.
Seriously, yes Eowyn could wield a sword & shield, but just because Grima hadn't fought for a long time does not necessarily give Eowyn an edge in strength. I know several girls who can wield a sword, whereas I-who have never tried wielding a sword-am much stronger than either of them.

Lhunardawen · 07-16-2004, 10:13 PM

Physically, maybe Grima would be stronger than Eowyn. But I believe Grima's stronger power is his voice--a "talent" he has learned from his mentor, Saruman. Through his voice he deceived Theoden and brought about his untimely dotage. But do we dare think that he would be able to use this on Eowyn? I think not. Eowyn knew all along (or at least, she had suspicions) that Grima has influenced his uncle and he is to blame for Theoden's condition at the time. Surely she has harbored hatred for Grima and would think twice before listening to his words.

Bombadil · 07-17-2004, 01:44 AM

Are you kidding? Eowyn is Bad @$$! I have full confidence she'd kick Grima back to Isengard. Let's not forget she killed (half-killed) the witchking!

Evisse the Blue · 07-17-2004, 05:06 AM

In that scene from TTT with Eowyn and Grima near Theodred's death bed, when he 'sweet talks' to her (using some of Aragorn's words from ROTK, as it has been already remarked on this forum), don't you get the impression that she is almost about to give in? But then she suddenly recovers, as if breaking a spell. Grima surely had a way with words, and Eowyn was, although very courageous and noble, sad and lonely. So, I think MovieEowyn might, in an alternate universe, given in to Grima, in a moment of weakness, and be very angsty about it afterwards.
But, without her consent, I don't think he would have been capable of overpowering her. Even if he is stronger than her (which I doubt), she knows how to fight better than he does.

Quote:

3. In his own strange way, he really does love her, and he would not take her unwilling-- he really wants her to love him all on her own.

I don't think he ever harboured such hopes (if he did, his sense of reality is really low), nor do I think that he loved her for who she was. What he felt for her was simply lust (like Morgoth felt for Luthien). The baddies is Tolkien's world don't seem to be capable of feeling love.

Eomer of the Rohirrim · 07-17-2004, 10:47 AM

Remember that Grima was a Man of Rohan, not a cartoon gnome like movie-Grima. Anyway, Grima was extremely sly. He apparently poisoned Theoden remember? I'm sure he would resort to such devilry if he wanted to do the deed with Eowyn.

I don't think he'd ever pluck up the courage to do it though.

Imladris · 07-17-2004, 11:34 AM

As I recall, in both book and movie, Eowyn was the promised prize to Grima when Saruman killed Rohan. Therefore, maybe he was not expecting to overpower her himself but that grief would do it for him.

As Evisse pointed out, she was almost on the point of giving in (at least that's the impression I get) and that was when she was in grief.

Cheers,
Imladris

Encaitare · 07-17-2004, 12:59 PM

You think it was just lust? You could be right, but I, ever the hopeless romantic, think it was a bit more than that, even if Grima's sense of love is extremely twisted. He actually understands her, more so than anyone else and I personally think he loves her spirit as much as her body.

07-17-2004, 01:44 AM	#3
Bombadil Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Old Forest Posts: 488	Are you kidding? Eowyn is Bad @$$! I have full confidence she'd kick Grima back to Isengard. Let's not forget she killed (half-killed) the witchking! __________________ "'Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'"

07-17-2004, 10:47 AM	#5
Eomer of the Rohirrim Auspicious Wraith Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 4,859	Remember that Grima was a Man of Rohan, not a cartoon gnome like movie-Grima. Anyway, Grima was extremely sly. He apparently poisoned Theoden remember? I'm sure he would resort to such devilry if he wanted to do the deed with Eowyn. I don't think he'd ever pluck up the courage to do it though. __________________ Los Ingobernables de Harlond

07-17-2004, 11:34 AM	#6
Imladris Tears of the Phoenix Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Putting dimes in the jukebox baby. Posts: 1,453	As I recall, in both book and movie, Eowyn was the promised prize to Grima when Saruman killed Rohan. Therefore, maybe he was not expecting to overpower her himself but that grief would do it for him. As Evisse pointed out, she was almost on the point of giving in (at least that's the impression I get) and that was when she was in grief. Cheers, Imladris __________________ I'm sorry it wasn't a unicorn. It would have been nice to have unicorns. I'm your huckleberry.

07-17-2004, 12:59 PM	#7
Encaitare Bittersweet Symphony Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: On the jolly starship Enterprise Posts: 1,814	Response to Evisse... You think it was just lust? You could be right, but I, ever the hopeless romantic, think it was a bit more than that, even if Grima's sense of love is extremely twisted. He actually understands her, more so than anyone else and I personally think he loves her spirit as much as her body.

07-16-2004, 10:13 PM	#2
Lhunardawen Hauntress of the Havens Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IN it, but not OF it Posts: 2,538	Physically, maybe Grima would be stronger than Eowyn. But I believe Grima's stronger power is his voice--a "talent" he has learned from his mentor, Saruman. Through his voice he deceived Theoden and brought about his untimely dotage. But do we dare think that he would be able to use this on Eowyn? I think not. Eowyn knew all along (or at least, she had suspicions) that Grima has influenced his uncle and he is to blame for Theoden's condition at the time. Surely she has harbored hatred for Grima and would think twice before listening to his words.